Alignment problem

Fri May 23 22:40:56 EDT 2003

Steve,
This is a standard G60 conversion setup with ABT/Koni combination, no other
selection reasons than they came on a previous 200 that was totaled, so I
moved them to the replacement 200.
The camber plates are the standard adjuster plates, I have the "Igor"
modification to permanently adjust the shock towers.
My car has no other parts in the suspension than the stock parts that I am
aware of.
My son's RS2 200 has the slotted adjuster plates in addition to the "Igor"
mod, for no other reason than we had them as an extra set in the garage.  I
agree with Bernie's assertion there is limited adjustment due to the spring
plate and strut tower structure interference, and having both mods installed
is probably not needed.

Now to my alignment settings:
                Left Front            Right Front
Camber        -0.85                    -0.62       degrees
Caster            1.88                    1.94        degrees
Toe                0.9 mm                0.9 mm
    Total Toe                  1.8 mm
    Steer Ahead           0.00 degrees

                Right Rear            Right Rear
Camber        -0.93                    -0.69        degrees
Toe                1.6mm                  1.6mm
    Total Toe                3.2mm
    Thrust Angle            0.00 degrees

The car is set for typically one 200# driver, no passengers, 50/50%
highway/city driving, assertive (not aggressive) driving.
I am running stock 15" BBS wheels with standard sized Firestone SH30 mud and
snow tires (came on the car,  I need a used SP8000 so I can put my 16"
wheels back on this car.).
The car drives straight, at freeway speeds is very comfortable (70-85 on the
last trip to Portland, OR).
I do not notice any particular tramlining in road ruts, like my previous 200
without either the camber plates slotted, or the "Igor" mod, and as I
recall, one side was never able to get quite into spec, only just close.
Tires are wearing uniformly across the tread after the alignment 15k miles a
go.

My son's car has been setup the same way by the same shop, and is having
similar driving results, even though he is running 17" SP9000 wheel and
tires.  Is satisfied with a track day event (300 track miles in 2 days),
with only the obvious outside shoulder wear you would expect.

This lowered alignment is probably better than the stock setup, although I
do not know what they were, same wheels and tires though.  My car was
aligned after the ABT/Koni combination was installed, so the setting before
alignment bear no resemble to any alignment settings.
Not advocating any particular solution here, just reporting how my car is
setup, the alignment, and my perception of the results (ok, this is my
disclaimer).  Hope this helps someone.
Gary Anderson in Sammamish

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steven Hauptmann" <hauptmanns at llr.sc.gov>
To: "'Gary Anderson'" <wanemardo at attbi.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 1:21 PM
Subject: RE: Alignment problem

> Did the camber plates you used replace the strut mounts? Were there any
> other mods required like using the S4/S6 spring retainer and bearing?
> Where did you source the camber plates?
>
> I would be interested in getting the alignment specs if is not to much
> trouble.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Steve Hauptmann
> South Carolina
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Anderson [mailto:wanemardo at attbi.com]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 6:59 PM
> To: Steven Hauptmann
> Subject: Re: Alignment problem
>
>
> Steve, same thing happened with my son's car.
> We put in slotted camber plates when we did the "Igor" upper spring plate
> adjustment, because I knew how, the struts were out and disassembled, and
we
> had an extra set of slotted camber plates laying around. Either one will
> provide enough adjustment as your car is lowered that 1.25" or so, its
just
> enough for the stock camber plates to maybe get into the edge of factory
> specs, BTDT with a previous 200, may its soul rest in piece, sot to speak.
> Son's problem has been fixed.
> Saw Bernie's post, he is pretty much right on, in particular finding a
good
> alignment shop, unfortunately, my preferred shop is in Seattle.
> I can send my alignment numbers if you need them, interesting point to
note
> is all four corners are not the same, but close, and that is how he setup
> the car for 50/50 highway/town, one driver (and weight), assertive (not
> aggressive) driving, etc...
> Both our cars are running straight, and son's RS2 setup with 17" and Bira
> boxster caliper has done nicely at track days with the same setup as my
car.
> Good luck.  Gary Anderson in Sammamish
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Steven Hauptmann" <hauptmanns at llr.sc.gov>
> To: "200q20v List (E-mail)" <200q20v at audifans.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 2:16 PM
> Subject: Alignment problem
>
>
> > Late last Spring, after converting from UFO's to G60's with used V8
strut
> > housings, and installing H&R's, Bilstein sports, new strut bearings, new
> > wheel bearings and new control arms, I had a set Dunlop D60 Sport A2's
> > installed to replace the worn Michelin XGT VR4's and had the alignment
> done
> > at the same time.
> >
> > After having the tires installed, I noticed a slight vibration around
> 80mph.
> > After a having them re-balanced a month or 3 later and realizing little
> (if
> > any) improvement, I chalked it up as a lesson learned. Don't go from a
> ~$130
> > Michelin to a ~$60 Dunlop and expect the same definition of round.
> >
> > Fast forward to last weekend.
> >
> > Driving to and from Atlanta Ga. (to install a set of Bilsteins on Dad's
> '93
> > 9000CSE { a Saab story}), I noticed the vibration had gotten worse and
now
> > started at ~65mph. Since this is the wife's daily driver, it had been a
> > while since I had anything more than a quick trip in the ole girl.
> >
> > So today I took it in to the have the tires checked out. I was feeling
> > confident that it might be a defective belt or something on one or more
> > tires that was starting to get worse with the 12k or so accumulated
miles.
> >
> > Well, that was sure a bad guess. The inside of both front tires are very
> > worn, to the point of needing replacement. The drivers side tire is
> already
> > bald. Apparently the drivers side camber is way out, at negative 1.7.
The
> > passenger side is better at negative 0.4.
> >
> > I understand that lowering the car  will add some negative
camber.....but
> > this is obviously from something else.
> > My initial guess is that the strut housing is bent, although it LOOKED
> fine
> > upon installation.
> >
> > So, this leaves me with the question of how to correct it??
> >
> > 1.  Buy another used V8 strut assembly for the drivers side and R&R all
> > associated parts including replacement of another $50 wheel bearing? Not
> > looking forward to repeating this so soon.
> >
> > 2.  Visit a frame shop and see if they can straighten it???
> >
> > 3.  Buy an adjustable camber set-up and adjust it out?? (if there's one
> > available for the type 44)
> >
> > Maybe it's something else?
> >
> >
> > Any thoughts?
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Steve Hauptmann
> > Columbia, SC.
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