latest on boost saga

Fri Dec 19 10:47:47 PST 2008

My dash gauge still reads up to 1.8, but since I have a (Hoppen) chip and
2.5bar MAP sensor replacing the stock 2.0bar MAP sensor, when my dash gauge
says 1.8 it's really 1.8 * (2.5/2.0) = 2.25bar (absolute). An in-dash
reading of 1.4 with a 3.0bar MAP would be 1.4 * (3/2) = 2.1bar (absolute). I
still think your dash gauge should be reading 1.8 if you're at "full boost"
regardless of the MAP sensor. But that's just me.

>
> yeah, this is what Dan at 034 emailed:
>
> As discussed on the phone, the car is making more boost, but your gauge
> will never tell you more than 1.4bar regardless.  The map sensor is
> bigger, and the ECU is re-calibrated for this, but there is no way to
> recalibrate the gauge.
>
>
>
> --- On Fri, 12/19/08, Brandon Rogers <brogers at terrix.com> wrote:
> From: Brandon Rogers <brogers at terrix.com>
> Subject: RE: latest on boost saga
> To: centaurus3200 at yahoo.com, "'200q20V mailing list'"
> <200q20v at audifans.com>
> Date: Friday, December 19, 2008, 10:21 AM
>
> You need a real boost gauge.  Stock  = useless
>
> Brandon
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 200q20v-bounces at audifans.com
> [mailto:200q20v-bounces at audifans.com] On
> Behalf Of robert weinberg
> Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 10:25 AM
> To: 200q20V mailing list
> Subject: Re: latest on boost saga
>
>
> picked the car up last night. they left it outside for me.
>
> i let it warm up, then punched it, hauls ass. more linear power band than
> with the IA3+ (Dan cut me a deal on the 034 chip set and 3.0 bar map
> sensor). i assume because the notched map sensor helps?
>
> specs:
> http://www.034motorsport.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_109&product
> s_id=18438
>
> with the IA3+, not much would happen until like 4k rpm, then
> BLAMMM!!! very
> Jekyll and Hyde. remember, i posted that i thought this was a little funky
> on the list before.
>
> i tried to get around a car once from low speed, i kept waiting, and
> waiting, then WHOOSH!
>
> the IA3+ might be a little more frisky of a tune than the 034 one
> though. or
> maybe the linearity of the 034 is less "exciting" that the IA3+?
>
> anywho, nothing goes without drama.
>
> i punched it on the freeway and the bastard still wouldn't go
> bast 1.4 bar.
> although the turbo was still doing it's thing. when i got off the freeway,
> i
> punched once the light turned green and i was nearly thrown
> through the back
> window. i couldn't see the boost gauge because my eyes were on the road.
>
> Dan at 034 did say the stock gauge would be useless with the 3.0 bar map
> sensor. i want him to discuss it in more detail with me.
>
> when they tested the car, they were driving around with an
> aftermarket gauge
> T'ed in. obviously, they don't think too highly of the stock gauge ;-)
>
> and of course, a rear koni started thunking after i hit a pothole on the
> frreeway. why i bought this flippen car is beyond me. but at this point, i
> have $6,500 into the damn thing (including the $2,800 purchase price). i
> can't get my money back out of it, so might as well go on that
> long journey
> of restoring it.
>
> see ya,
> Robby
>
> --- On Wed, 12/17/08, Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net> wrote:
> From: Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
> Subject: Re: latest on boost saga
> To: centaurus3200 at yahoo.com, "200 20v List"
> <200q20v at audifans.com>
> Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 7:59 PM
>
> Thanks, Robby - glad it seems the problem is solved. Guess I am not sure
> just which hose is the ECU MAP hose.
>
> Put on some snow tires and come to MT and we can try it out. Believe me,
> boost is *awesome" at 10- 20 deg below air temps but one does have to
> watch
> out for the ice <g>
>
> mike
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: robert weinberg
> To: 200q20v at audifans.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 8:41 PM
> Subject: Re: latest on boost saga
>
>
> awesome post Mike!
>
> well, i got the call from dan at 034 at 5pm. according to them, they have
> finally solved the issue. they said nearly every ground wire and terminal
> was corroded. they said the ecu MAP hose was leaky too.
>
> i decided to give ian back his ia3+ ecu and go for the $250
> discount on the
> 034 stage I (280 HP) and 3 bar notched MAP sensor.
>
> they said the car lit up the street repeatedly and without fail. and,
> according to their tech Nate, it's hella fast (SF bay area ;-)
>
> so, pulling the turbo was an expensive endevor (even at their buddy deal
> $55/hr), but at least i know every inch of the car has been gone over by
> javad and crew.
>
> gonna pick it up tomorrow. and being it's an old T44 audi, i fully expect
> the problem to recurr on the way home ;-)
>
> see ya,
> Robby
>
> --- On Wed, 12/17/08, Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net> wrote:
> From: Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
> Subject: Re: latest on boost saga
> To: centaurus3200 at yahoo.com, 200q20v at audifans.com
> Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 7:21 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Hi Robby,
>
> I'll take a stab at it here as I have BTDT with low
> boost when I bought my 1st 200q in 1996. I had a normal reading
> on the WGFV
> but it was bad - Ned Ritchie of IA and I spent many hours
> troubleshooting it
> and I think mine was the 3rd one found to be bad in the US. Took over a
> month to get the part from the father land.
>
> If you pinch of that hose from the WGFV to the WG,
> you will remove ALL ECU control of the WG. Have you done that yet?
>
> You say you have a new Bypass valve correctly
> installed. Have you verified the hose the entire length from the
> back of the
> Intake Manifold to the Bypass valve? If anything is bad ( like it
> is crimped
> at the bracket on the back of the IM) the Bypass valve will dump boost
> prematurely.
>
> Good to hear you have the Samco's - that should
> eliminate any leaks there - which would show up on a pressure
> test anyways.
>
>
> I don't recall what you are seeing for low boost
> when you do experience it. Is it possible the car is in limp home mode (
> 1.3-1.4
> bar) due to a bad MAF sensor? Try to borrow one if possible as they are
> quite expensive.
>
> There is a high altitude sensor - when I turn on my
> key at 5000 ft elev. the boost gauge reads .9 or .8 bar. With stock ECU I
> would never see over 1.7 bar and yet I would get 1.8 bar under
> about 3000 ft
> elev. At 10k+ ft elev boost was limited to 1.6 bar as I recall.
> The purpose
> here is to prevent over spinning the turbo in the thinner high alt. air. I
> guess they figured 100k rpm was enough :-)
>
> Basically, the WGFV is the way the ECU controls
> boost - it pulses the WG and prevents it opening at lower boost
> and then it
> allows it to open as you approach the max boost your ECU allows. If you
> exceed max boost ( like with the hose pinched off or a stiffer WG spring)
> the ECU will ground the fuel pump and not allow you to exceed 1.3-1.4 bar
> until the ignition is cycled.
>
> Your problem (to me) sounds like an issue with
> either the hose to the bypass valve or a flaky MAF sensor. If you are
> running a K&N air filter, some people have experienced the oil from the
> filter coating and ruining the MAF sensor - I have never had the problem
> personally. I am assuming you have checked the air filter - I did have a
> rodent build a nest in my F350 airbox a few yrs ago the severly limited
> boost. Little SOB chewed out the bottom of the filter and used it and sone
> underhood insulation for nesting material. Went from 24 lbs boost
> to 14 lbs.
>
> You may not know that you can driil out the top of
> the WG in the center and tighten down the screw inside to increase spring
> pressure - allows for faster spool up of the turbo - same as putting in a
> stiffer WG spring only "free".
>
> I think I saw where you said you had checked
> *every* fuse in the fuse box. I think there are a couple there that will
> limit boost - like that double one nearest the fender in the middle with
> "moteur" or something like that labeled on it.
>
> Just out of curiosity, what are you seeing for fuel
> economy? I'm running an MTM chip ( have run stock and Hoppen
> stage 1) and I
> see 21-22 around town and 25-28 hwy. The reason I ask is that a clogged
> Cat-con can cause low mileage and low boost. A loose part in the exhaust
> will occasionally allow normal performance. Just one more thing to look at
> :-)
>
> hope some of that is useful
>
> mike
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: robert
> weinberg
> To: 200q20v at audifans.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:53 PM
> Subject: Re: latest on boost saga
>
> hi mike,
>
> it's an 034 billet bypass. it was installed
> correctly.
>
> i wish i knew what the stock ecu did but i bought the car with a dead
> autocheck. boost, trip, etc. i chipped the car while it was still dead.
>
> i developed the boost issues. somewhere in between, i got around to
> frankensteining a another dash's electronics (that white flip down back
> panel)
> onto my dash which fixed the autcheck, et al.
>
> i'm also running samco
> hoses - any leaky boost and vaccuum lines were just replaced by 034.
>
> there's definitely something screwy going on with the computer and the
> wgfv.
> it's reading 1.4 bar like it's not even connected - but it is. 034
> tried a
> known working valve. no change. they measured the correct signal from the
> computer to the connector.
>
> but something is getting mixed up. and
> sometimes, it works and the car is a flippen rocket.
>
> help me learn, what
> is the purpose of the whole WGFV system? to allow the computer to lower
> boost at high altitude?
>
> from my understanding, that's the only time the computer
> lowers boost. it does not lower boost during detonation, correct?
> only pulls
> out timing.
>
> Regards,
> Robby
>
> --- On Wed, 12/17/08, Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
> wrote:
> From: Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
> Subject:
> Re: latest on boost saga
> To: 200q20v at audifans.com
> Date: Wednesday,
> December 17, 2008, 4:39 PM
>
> I forget - has the turbo bypass valve been
> replaced and is it hooked up
> correctly? It is easy to hook up backwards which
> I believe can limit boost. What
> kind of boost does a stock ECU make when
> installed?
>
> mike
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: Chris
> Miller
> To: 200q20v at audifans.com
>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:15 PM
> Subject: Re: latest on boost
> saga
>
>
> I'd hook up a test light (LED) to the wastegate frequency valve (WGFV).
> That
> way you can watch what the computer is telling the WGFV to do. If I recall
> correctly, the LED should light up solid then flash rapidly as
> boost builds.
> If the light stops flashing or goes off, that means the signal from the
> computer is not closing the WGFV and you'll have the 1.4 bar boost max.
> Make
> the lead to the LED long enough and you can stick the LED under the
> windshield wiper and watch it while driving (or run it in the
> window to the
> dash).
>
> Check the basics, too; grounds; wiring
> condition at the multifunction temp
> sensor; condition of the gear on the end
> of the distributor.
>
> Chris
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 17, 2008 at
> 10:42 AM, robert weinberg
> <centaurus3200 at yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> 034
> says they GAURANTEE they've checked every flippen sensor or possibility
> with
> the car. at least she did boost for a little bit with my computer. Dan at
> 034 said he can believe the ecu going bad - like the pressure transducer
> - but
> what would make for a flakey chip? they are open to suggestions.
>
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