Subject: stumped
Shin Hoshikawa
pl510er at comcast.net
Thu Feb 25 17:39:05 PST 2010
Mike:
Do you know if your wastegate diaphragm is okay? It seems your symptom is
not exactly the same as when it is ripped, but who knows?
89 Audi 200Q
90 Audi V8
91 Audi 200 20V - Stock
91 Audi 200 20V - Chipped
96 Audi S6
pl510er at comcast.net
-----Original Message-----
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Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010 12:00 PM
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Subject: 200q20v Digest, Vol 76, Issue 15
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Today's Topics:
1. stumped (Mike Miller)
2. Re: stumped (PeterBergin at aol.com)
3. Re: stumped (Kent McLean)
4. Re: stumped (Bernie Benz)
5. Re: stumped (Mike Miller)
6. Re. Toyota rant (Ben Swann)
7. RE: Re. Toyota rant (Roger Woodbury)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 13:33:38 -0700
From: "Mike Miller" <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
Subject: stumped
To: "200 20v List" <200q20v at audifans.com>
Message-ID: <035701cab590$a5227f60$0800a8c0 at lcs2>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="Windows-1252";
reply-type=original
I've been chasing a bad miss problem for a while. I seems to be getting
worse. Spark plugs all look good and I've swapped out the wires. I've
replaced the MAF and ECU (now stock) and have no vacuum leaks. I can make
full boost according to the dash gauge and I can hit high RPMs. (6000+). The
car runs smoother above 3k rpm. I am getting 1.6 boost at about 1/8th
throttle and can make the boost jump in neutral up to 1.1 (.8 is normal for
my altitude (4800ft) with the engine off/ingntion on).
At slight throttle, there is a steady miss that magnifies as the throttle is
increased. The miss is worse the higher the gear. There is no miss when the
throttle is lifted. Initially, as long as I kept boost under 1.0, it ran
fine but now it is missing even at .8 bar.
I'm wondering if the Cat is clogged - thoughts?? That might explain the
abnormally high boost with very little throttle. It holds about 1.6/1.7 from
about 1/8th throttle clear to about 7/8ths (don't feel any acceleration
change) - WOT will then push it up to 1.8.
mike
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 15:36:18 EST
From: PeterBergin at aol.com
Subject: Re: stumped
To: mikemilr at blackfoot.net, 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <35bce.78dd8b45.38b6e7c2 at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
When mine did that years ago, I spent some $'S on the usual suspects.
Brought it to shop and put a scope on it. Was cracked porcelain on #1
plug.
All I could see was a very very light brown line on the plug. Mine missed
only under load.
Pete
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 16:17:47 -0500
From: Kent McLean <kentmclean at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: stumped
To: 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <4B85977B.5070101 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
PeterBergin at aol.com wrote:
> When mine did that years ago, I spent some $'S on the usual suspects.
> Brought it to shop and put a scope on it. Was cracked porcelain on #1
plug.
> All I could see was a very very light brown line on the plug. Mine
missed
> only under load.
Shade tree mechanic approach -- some night take it somewhere dark,
open the hood, leave it running, and look for sparks near the plug
wire joints. A fine mist of water from a spray bottle might help
expose any stray electrical seepage.
--
Kent McLean
1990 V8 w/5-speed and other mods
1991 200 TQA #3, with mods
1999 A4 Avant, V6 Tiptronic
gone: '91 200 TQA x2, '94 100 S Avant, '89 200 TQ "Bad Puppy"
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 14:50:11 -0800
From: Bernie Benz <b.benz at charter.net>
Subject: Re: stumped
To: Mike Miller <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
Cc: 200q20V mailing list <200q20v at audifans.com>
Message-ID: <68318B96-D217-436E-AF64-74E306AA739A at charter.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes;
format=flowed
Mike,
I?ll add to the ignition consensus. BTDT. Unhook one plug wire at a
time and test. When one unhook makes no difference you?ve found the
right line. Move that plug to another cylinder or replace that high
tension wire, etc.
My problem was one bad plug, no visible problem with it. Replaced the
one plug and all are going strong at 225K. Those stock Pt plugs are
great, last for ever. I?ll use them in the A6 2.7T if I ever need to
replace the cheap original stuff.
Bernie
On Feb 24, 2010, at 12:33 PM, Mike Miller wrote:
> I've been chasing a bad miss problem for a while. I seems to be
> getting
> worse. Spark plugs all look good and I've swapped out the wires. I've
> replaced the MAF and ECU (now stock) and have no vacuum leaks. I
> can make
> full boost according to the dash gauge and I can hit high RPMs.
> (6000+). The
> car runs smoother above 3k rpm. I am getting 1.6 boost at about 1/8th
> throttle and can make the boost jump in neutral up to 1.1 (.8 is
> normal for
> my altitude (4800ft) with the engine off/ingntion on).
>
> At slight throttle, there is a steady miss that magnifies as the
> throttle is
> increased. The miss is worse the higher the gear. There is no miss
> when the
> throttle is lifted. Initially, as long as I kept boost under 1.0,
> it ran
> fine but now it is missing even at .8 bar.
>
> I'm wondering if the Cat is clogged - thoughts?? That might explain
> the
> abnormally high boost with very little throttle. It holds about
> 1.6/1.7 from
> about 1/8th throttle clear to about 7/8ths (don't feel any
> acceleration
> change) - WOT will then push it up to 1.8.
>
> mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> 200q20v mailing list http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/200q20v
------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 16:03:59 -0700
From: "Mike Miller" <mikemilr at blackfoot.net>
Subject: Re: stumped
To: "Bernie Benz" <b.benz at charter.net>
Cc: 200q20V mailing list <200q20v at audifans.com>
Message-ID: <03b301cab5a5$a6c72220$0800a8c0 at lcs2>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252"
UPDATE: I replaced the plugs and it made no difference. Put my inductive
pick up timing light on each plug wire and watched it fire. # 4 did not fire
at all. I replaced that wire and it now fires and the car runs better. It
still misses under load though. Kent suggested looking at the engine when
running when it gets dark - I'll try that tonight and see what I can (or
cannot) see.
I still don't understand why boost is comng on so early. I used to see 1.7
bar max at this altitude - now I see 1.8 at way less than 1/4 throttle. I
still wonder about a clogged Cat. Bypass valve, MAF, WGFV have all been
replaced. Chipped ECU removed and replaced with a stock one. None of that
made any difference - although I replaced those for a _low_ boost problem
that went away when it started to miss under load.
mike
----- Original Message -----
From: Bernie Benz
To: Mike Miller
Cc: 200q20V mailing list
Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2010 3:50 PM
Subject: Re: stumped
Mike,
I?ll add to the ignition consensus. BTDT. Unhook one plug wire at a
time and test. When one unhook makes no difference you?ve found the
right line. Move that plug to another cylinder or replace that high
tension wire, etc.
My problem was one bad plug, no visible problem with it. Replaced the
one plug and all are going strong at 225K. Those stock Pt plugs are
great, last for ever. I?ll use them in the A6 2.7T if I ever need to
replace the cheap original stuff.
Bernie
On Feb 24, 2010, at 12:33 PM, Mike Miller wrote:
> I've been chasing a bad miss problem for a while. I seems to be
> getting
> worse. Spark plugs all look good and I've swapped out the wires. I've
> replaced the MAF and ECU (now stock) and have no vacuum leaks. I
> can make
> full boost according to the dash gauge and I can hit high RPMs.
> (6000+). The
> car runs smoother above 3k rpm. I am getting 1.6 boost at about 1/8th
> throttle and can make the boost jump in neutral up to 1.1 (.8 is
> normal for
> my altitude (4800ft) with the engine off/ingntion on).
>
> At slight throttle, there is a steady miss that magnifies as the
> throttle is
> increased. The miss is worse the higher the gear. There is no miss
> when the
> throttle is lifted. Initially, as long as I kept boost under 1.0,
> it ran
> fine but now it is missing even at .8 bar.
>
> I'm wondering if the Cat is clogged - thoughts?? That might explain
> the
> abnormally high boost with very little throttle. It holds about
> 1.6/1.7 from
> about 1/8th throttle clear to about 7/8ths (don't feel any
> acceleration
> change) - WOT will then push it up to 1.8.
>
> mike
>
> _______________________________________________
> 200q20v mailing list http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/200q20v
------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2010 08:54:46 -0500
From: "Ben Swann" <benswann at verizon.net>
Subject: Re. Toyota rant
To: <rmwoodbury at roadrunner.com>
Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <004901cab622$177a1320$0201a8c0 at swansong>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Good points and good writing.
Toyota screwed up by not nipping the problem in the bud before it grew out
of control.
Politics is destined to bring the company to its knees, at least in the
short run - of
course the folks that will pay for it will be the ones who can least afford
it - the
workers, not the corporate officials who pretty much tried to sweep the
problem under
the rug.
I believe a combination of problems will come to light when the
investigation is
complete. It will likely be a compound problem of sensors, drive by wire
control unit
code, and mechanical hangups.
Ben
[Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 08:09:10 -0500
From: "Roger Woodbury" <rmwoodbury at roadrunner.com>
Subject: Toyota rant
To: <v8 at audifans.com>
Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <E8.68.15851.0D4258B4 at cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
For what it is worth, I have begun my rant about the decline and fall of
vaunted Toyota "quality" at www.acadiareaders.com.
Probably worth nothing, but then again, at least it keeps me off the streets
and out of the bars and other places of ill repute.
Roger]
------------------------------
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2010 09:00:23 -0500
From: "Roger Woodbury" <rmwoodbury at roadrunner.com>
Subject: RE: Re. Toyota rant
To: "'Ben Swann'" <benswann at verizon.net>
Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <83.2A.15851.F42868B4 at cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Thanks, Ben. The series is going to be several essays lightly discussing
the origins and development of Japanese quality in contrast with, and
ultimately destroyed by, familiarity with American automobile build
practices. I am going to try to get this series done in the next two to
three weeks, and only wish I could just do this instead of other necessities
of life, too.
Roger
_____
From: Ben Swann [mailto:benswann at verizon.net]
Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2010 8:55 AM
To: rmwoodbury at roadrunner.com
Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
Subject: Re. Toyota rant
Good points and good writing.
Toyota screwed up by not nipping the problem in the bud before it grew out
of control. Politics is destined to bring the company to its knees, at
least in the short run - of course the folks that will pay for it will be
the ones who can least afford it - the workers, not the corporate officials
who pretty much tried to sweep the problem under the rug.
I believe a combination of problems will come to light when the
investigation is complete. It will likely be a compound problem of sensors,
drive by wire control unit code, and mechanical hangups.
Ben
[Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2010 08:09:10 -0500
From: "Roger Woodbury" <rmwoodbury at roadrunner.com>
Subject: Toyota rant
To: <v8 at audifans.com>
Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
Message-ID: <E8.68.15851.0D4258B4 at cdptpa-omtalb.mail.rr.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
For what it is worth, I have begun my rant about the decline and fall of
vaunted Toyota "quality" at <file:///\\www.acadiareaders.com>
www.acadiareaders.com.
Probably worth nothing, but then again, at least it keeps me off the streets
and out of the bars and other places of ill repute.
Roger]
------------------------------
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