My Letter to Electromotive RE: Tec III system

[Iain Mannix]

We put it on a VW Scirocco autocross car - TecII - and frankly, I'd
not bother with it for a street car.

The Scirocco was a dedicated autocross car; no emissions, legality
was not a concern(beyond SCCA rules), and it fit the bill well.
We used a TWM manifold and 4 TWM 45mm DCOE style throttlebodies(1.8
liter motor).  Initial tuning was a pain.  End result was a semi
tempermental car that went like hell(for what it was).  We did not
use much of the built in stuff for drivability - coolant temp,
knock sensor, etc - just tuned it for power.  Once sorted, it was
reliable, although the crank trigger in the VW is susceptible to
rocks getting flung up, taking a ride between the trigger wheel
and sensor.  Car stops.  That could easily be addressed, naturally,
but basically, the Tec2 seems like an awful lot of work and cost
when there are other things that'll give you more power.

Infinitely adjustable fuel curves are conceptually neat.  They're
also something of a pain in the butt - in our case, the "baseline
map" was just that.  Sure, the car "ran," but barely.

The number of maps that the car will *not* run on dramatically
outnumbers those it will run on.

Could it be made to work on a street car?  Absolutely.  It'd work
well, if you took the time to make it _right_.  It is easy to
adjust, diagnose, install - it is super picky about grounds,
so it should fit right in on an Audi;), it is very flexible,
has provisions for lots of boost, options for management,
it is a very cool device.  We liked it, overall, but we were
working within a ruleset that only allowed certain things -
and the Electromotive/some sort of management device was the
next step in power gains.

A cam would have given more power.
Porting the head would have given more power.
Increased compression would have given more power.

And so on - I can see it's appeal on a turbo car, as it makes
high boost management pretty easy, but it seems to me that the
ability to run high/realistic boost is pretty well covered
by the stuff out there.

It is as reliable as the installation.  In our experience, the
Tec brains(I've dealt with several now, both the Tec2 and
HPV variants) are either good or bad - if they work, they're
going to work.  If they're bad, they act flaky from day one.
That said, I know a guy who dragged his GP car to the Runoffs,
qualified well, 2nd lap of the race the car fell over.  Tec2.
Doh.  Can happen with anything, I know, but honestly, the stock
ecus are pretty good.

Dunno!  I'd bark up other trees first for a street car, but
once you've turned every other leaf over, it is solid, it works,
it is guaranteed to give you a headache(either thinking about
time over gamma or some such, or the raw fuel filling your
garage;), but once it works, it works.  I like it, but it
seems unrealistic for a street car, at least to me.

Our current race car has an HpV 3b - and we love it.
Electromotive is a good company, and as far as the letter
below, that(IMHO) is the wrong way to approach things
with them.  They're WAY helpful, and if you were to call
them, tell them what you're thinking, and find out if
they'd make one for a 5cyl/adapt the 6cyl one to the 5,
I'm sure they'd be accomodating.  Naturally, one would
hope you actually (you being the author of the semi
scathing letter) want to *buy* one - not just complaining
because they don't make what you want to put on your
wish list of "someday" parts:).  They cater to the racer
set, and I'd guess the demand for 5-cyl applications has
been low - but they'd be happy to help you get it sorted out,
IME.


Iain Mannix

On Fri, 25 Jan 2002, Holman, Scott wrote:

> Does anyone on this board actually have experience with an Electromotive System?  I've been toying with the idea for my 12V A4, but probably couldn't do the installation myself.  My major problem is that I haven't found a shop near Pittsburgh, PA that I would trust for something like a complete engine management system.
>
> Thanks,
> Scott
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ScottyCBoy at aol.com [mailto:ScottyCBoy at aol.com]
> Sent: Friday, January 25, 2002 2:24 PM
> To: quattro at audifans.com
> Subject: Re: My Letter to Electromotive RE: Tec III system
>
> Yikes!! This was a bit rough. Why send it though. Electromotive has a right to manufacture anything they want. That would be like me getting upset at the Audi dealer for not stocking the parts I need for my 20 year old Audi.
>
> On another note I talked with electromotive and they said that their systems aren't specifically made for a 5 cylinder engine but can be adapted to one.
>
> Scott
>
>
> In a message dated Fri, 25 Jan 2002  2:04:13 PM Eastern Standard Time, "Aaron Gibson" <crankshaft at adelphia.net> writes:
>
> > It sounds a little harsh. Why pick a fight?
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Richard Hoffman" <billzcat1 at hotmail.com>
> > To: <audi20v at rennlist.org>; <quattro at audifans.com>
> > Sent: Friday, January 25, 2002 12:52 AM
> > Subject: My Letter to Electromotive RE: Tec III system
> >
> >
> > This is the unedited text of the letter I sent to Electromotive this
> > evening.  Let's see how it goes, shall we?
> >
> >
> > Dear Electromotive,
> > I had a few questions regarding your new TecIII system.
> > Just to confirm - the new TecIII system will run 1, 2, 3, 4, and 6 cylinder
> > motors.  Why did this system get developed without support for a 5 cylinder
> > motor?????
> > I know a great number of Audi, VW, Volvo, Saab, and Fiat enthusiasts that
> > are disappointed in the aftermarket engine management systems of today.  I
> > would suggest doing some MARKET RESEARCH before developing a system that
> > could run my lawnmower, my GEO METRO, and not my Audi sports coupe.
> > I realize there is a lot of work required to engineer an engine management
> > system.  You must realize that there is a demand and that development costs
> > would not be wasted.
> > Thank you for a wonderful product!  I will certainly appreciate the 47hp
> > Honda lawnmower I can develop with your help.
> >
> > Sincerely,
> > Richard Hoffman
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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