werid CIS-3 timing problem

[ed armstrong]

Your reading my mind! Thats next on the list to do.

I really think that this was alll precipitated by some
bad gas and hot days that forced the timing into
retard. Although now I have good gas and the weather
has cooled somewhat, I'm having trouble getting the
CIS to "unlearn" itself back to the previous state.

There got to be a solution somewhere.
--

- JShadzi at aol.com wrote:
> Interesting, yes, with the fuse in the ecu it is
> disabled from making idle and timing changes.  You
> say you don't have ANY codes currently?  have you
> tried setting the timing once it retards, typically
> timing is advanced when the car is "cold".
>
> Javad
>
> >Javad,
> >
> >Thanks for the advice. I'll start playing with the
> >timing a little more.
> >
> >Last night I did a little more troubleshooting and
> it
> >definitely seems to be jumping to different timing
> >maps. I warmed up the car and drove around a
> little,
> >checked the timing and it was retarded (> 0).
>  Waited
> >a little while, restarted the motor (still warm)
> and
> >it was at 6 BTDC ! Then drove it and it retarded
> >again.
> >These checks were with no fuse in the FPR.
> >
> >With the fuse in, the engine characteristics really
> >change: Idle comes up and then stabilizes at
> 720rpm,
> >timing stablizes at 6-7 BTDC and curiously the
> vacuum
> >at idle _increases_ to 16 inches from 13 inches !
> >
> >Very weird stuff !
> >
> >
> >--- JShadzi at aol.com wrote:
> >> Well, one think you're finding is a quirk in the
> >> CIS3 ignition system, yes, it does have different
> >> maps for high and low octane (pinging or no
> >> pinging), even the slightest pink will send the
> >> ignition into the "regular fuel timing map", in
> >> which all timing is retarded.  Restarting the car
> >> probably solves your problem right?  That's
> becuase
> >> each time you restart the car is begins in the
> >> "premium ign. map" and the process starts over
> >> again.  You should try retarding the timing
> another
> >> degree or two and maybe richening up your CO a
> >> little.  Another strategy is advancing the timing
> a
> >> little so that when it does go into the regular
> ign.
> >> map you'll have a higher base timing.
> >>
> >> Its kinda tricky, just keep playing around with
> it
> >> and see what works for you, don't worry about a
> >> little pinging here and there, these motors are
> >> tough and can handle it for the most part.
> >>
> >> HTH,
> >> Javad
> >>
> >> >
> >> >Yup, done all that. Car warm, idle at 720 rpm,
> >> mixture
> >> >OK. I'll do more troubleshooting tonight and see
> >> what
> >> >I can find.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >--- JShadzi at aol.com wrote:
> >> >> Make sure you set your timing with the car
> warm,
> >> at
> >> >> 800rpm,  and with the fuse in the FPR, have
> you
> >> done
> >> >> that?
> >> >>
> >> >> Javad
> >> >>
> >> >> >Hi
> >> >> >
> >> >> >I've run into a wierd CIS-3 ignition timing
> >> problem
> >> >> on
> >> >> >my 90tq conversion. The thing is that when I
> set
> >> >> the
> >> >> >initial idle timing to 6-7 deg BTDC, after a
> >> drive
> >> >> >around the block it is retarded, I not sure
> >> quite
> >> >> how
> >> >> >much, but at least 7 degrees.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >If I put in the fuse on top the fuel pump
> relay
> >> as
> >> >> the
> >> >> >Bentley calls for (for checking idle timing)
> the
> >> >> >timing comes back to 7 BTDC. Its like its
> >> switching
> >> >> >between timing maps or something !
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Any ideas on this one ? The car does at times
> >> seem
> >> >> >sluggish off idle as one might expect for
> >> retarded
> >> >> >timeing.  Other times it seems OK.  I should
> >> >> mention
> >> >> >this engine is 8.5:1 compression unlike the
> >> stock
> >> >> >10:1.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Some other diagnostics. Idle is fine at 730
> rpm,
> >> no
> >> >> >vacuum leaks, no knocks or pings, decent 91
> >> octane
> >> >> gas
> >> >> >used, knock sensor seems OK, no error codes.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >=====
> >> >> >-ed
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >>
> >__________________________________________________
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> >> >
> >> >
> >> >=====
> >> >-ed
> >> >
> >>
> >__________________________________________________
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> >> >
> >
> >
> >=====
> >-ed
> >
> >__________________________________________________
> >Do you Yahoo!?
> >Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more
> >http://taxes.yahoo.com/
> >


=====
-ed

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