Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)

Mon Apr 19 09:01:38 EDT 2004

I hear ya and agree that it really does sound like the timing between the
cam and crank is off, but I've checked it _several_ times between when the
problem started and now, and even though the problem has gotten steadily
worse, the index marks on the flywheel and the cam toothed pulley line up
perfectly.  Also, checking the timing while cranking shows a fire on #1 at
approx. 12 deg BTDC, right where it should be, so that is kind of a
double-check.  Great compression across all five cylinders.  But what the
hell, I've checked everything else, so I might take the whole damn front end
off the car (again) to check the pulley.  I'm frankly still at a loss- I've
got (fresh) gas (plugs wet after prolonged cranking, a little puddle on top
of each piston too), compression and spark seemingly at the right time.  I
tried pulling a vac hose off and squirting some starting fluid in the intake
and it really didn't try too hard to start- maybe one cyl hit, otherwise
that didn't even work.  The vac system holds pressure pretty well too, so no
gross amounts of free air getting in the way.  
You would think the thing would work with me a little bit. 

Thanks!

Charley 
-----Original Message-----
From: Ado Sigal [mailto:a.sigal at bluewin.ch] 
Sent: Sunday, April 18, 2004 4:27 AM
Cc: Charles.DePenning at EmersonProcess.com; quattro at audifans.com
Subject: Re: Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)

Although you've said that the timing checked OK, the circumstances and the
signs are consistent with broken crank woodruff key.
Belt can't slip until it looses several teeth, and if that happens at speed,
the engine would die instantly, you've had the engine gradually dying, as
the crank sprocket together with balancer pulley slowly moved the timing out
of range, until the valves interfered and then died for good. IMO, that's
where the problem is, and if the valves even slightly interfered, its 99%
sure valve job. As Kurt said, compression test would tell, but first
establish and fix the timing problem, and when the engine is running, the
quality of idle would tell you the state of valves, just as much as comp
test.

Ado

Kurt Deschler wrote:

> Check the timing belt. Sounds like telltale slipping. I hope your 
> motor isn't interference if thats thats the case since you were 
> hearing funny noises. It is possible for valves to lightly contact 
> pistons and not bend them (dents the pistons or worse). Check compression
anyways.
> 	-Kurt
> 
> 
>>Message: 3
>>Date: Thu, 15 Apr 2004 12:08:44 -0500
>>From: Hoffman Anthony J A1C 552 CMS/MXMVC
>>	<Anthony.Hoffman at tinker.af.mil>
>>Subject: RE: Not-running 90q  (was poorly-running)
>>To: "'DePenning, Charles [EPM/MTN]'"
>>	<Charles.DePenning at EmersonProcess.com>
>>Cc: "'Quattro at audifans.com'" <Quattro at audifans.com>
>>Message-ID: <200404151710.i3FHAapd020927 at legolas.tinker.af.mil>
>>Content-Type: text/plain
>>
>>The first thing I would do is get some new sparkplugs (autolite,
>>etc----cheap) and put them in. this will probably get it running 
>>(poorly) again. Then check for vacuum leaks around the injectors, by 
>>spraying water there - if the engine runs worse, there is a leak. I 
>>have also experienced dirty fuel pressure regulators on the CIS-E 
>>cars. I've succesfully cleaned a few with carb cleaner. Unscrew it 
>>from the fuel distributor, and spray the holes in the front with the 
>>carb cleaner. This should clean it out. You should also consider 
>>cleaning the fuel distributor. The way I've done this is to unscrew 
>>the holder(big nut) from the bottom of the distributor, and let the 
>>piston drop out, then run the pump (it will dump gas out the bottom of 
>>the distributor, so put a bucket or something under it) and this 
>>should clean any big pieces that would get stuck. Then, put it back
together and see.
>>
>>Tony Hoffman
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: DePenning, Charles [EPM/MTN]
>>[mailto:Charles.DePenning at EmersonProcess.com]
>>Sent: 15-Apr-2004 8:48 AM
>>To: 'quattro at audifans.com'
>>Subject: Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)
>>
>>
>>I'm still scratching my head with my '89 90q that flatly refuses to 
>>run right.  Very lumpy idle, no power at all, sounds like it's missing 
>>on a few cylinders.  Happened suddenly at highway speed.  I've been 
>>working with the assistance of folks on this list to cure the problem, 
>>working mainly on the CIS side of things.  I've checked and 
>>double-checked about everything I can, and all components look to be 
>>right in spec.  Exhaust is open- no clogged cat.  Last night I just 
>>let the car run until it was well warmed-up, and the missing behavior 
>>got worse and worse, until it sounded like it was running on 2 cylinders,
barely staying running, with some very strange 'clanking'
>>sounds coming from the engine- sounded like mechanical interference, 
>>but might have been pre-detonation or knocking, which sounds similar.  
>>Then it died, and would not re-start.  I had a thought that maybe the 
>>gas was bad enough after sitting for three months that maybe it was 
>>causing the problem- not likely, but I've tried about everything else.  
>>So I drained the gas from the tank (using the fuel pump through the 
>>fuel return line in the engine
>>compartment) and put 5 gallons of fresh gas in the tank.  Still just 
>>wouldn't start.  I waited until this morning, engine cool.  No start.
>>Before, I could at least get it to start and run lumpily.  Now 
>>nothing.  I pulled all five plugs and checked spark at each- good.  
>>Compression still good.  Each cylinder smelled of gas and the plugs 
>>were slightly wet and I could see a little gas on top of the pistons.  
>>I am at a loss to find what is steadily getting so non-functional that 
>>with fuel and spark both present, I can't get the thing to even fire a 
>>little.  Any help would greatly be appreciated!
>>
>>TIA,
>>
>>Charley DePenning
>>'89 90q
>>'84 4kq
>>'83 5kT
>>
>>
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>>quattro at audifans.com http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
>>
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