quattro Digest, Vol 2, Issue 212
Fred no
frederick999991 at hotmail.com
Thu Jan 1 14:26:06 EST 2004
hmm i dont see much point in changing the injectors unless you have leaky
ones... pull them all out turn on the key so pump primes a few times and
check of ther fuel leaking this will not make your engine go lean its
actually the contrary and usually floods it. When i was younger id the the
flapper thingy but found out i had a vacuum leak hidden on the isv hose
inside the intake but to move the car i just put a screwdriver under the
flapper started engine it ran at around 2500 rpm so i was able to move the
car out of the way for a few days... you could always do a injector output
test ( testing procedure is in the bently ) butusually someone changes
injectors because there leaking... if corrosion particles or dryness gets in
them. Are you shure you have 100%
Also were both engine working well prior ?And what system are you on now?
Anyways i'm recovering from last night so happy new year..
>From: quattro-request at audifans.com
>Reply-To: quattro at audifans.com
>To: quattro at audifans.com
>Subject: quattro Digest, Vol 2, Issue 212
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 12:26:24 -0500 (EST)
>
>Send quattro mailing list submissions to
> quattro at audifans.com
>
>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>
>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>than "Re: Contents of quattro digest..."
>
>
>Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: re. Sad sight of a Porsche 911. email (Ben Swann)
> 2. RE: Seattle Snow!!! Yeahhhh!!!!!! (Nate Beck)
> 3. Re: I hit a pothole... (Dan DiBiase)
> 4. Re: Pot hole help on collecting from CT (SuffolkD at aol.com)
> 5. Re: Gas prices - was metric tools (Per Lindgren)
> 6. Re: Gas prices - was metric tools (Robert Myers)
> 7. Re: CIS-e problems (Ben Swann)
> 8. Re: Any listers in Italy? (Steve Meyer)
> 9. Re: cis-e help!! [NG CIS-E3] (Ben Swann)
> 10. Re: CIS-e problems (Ben Swann)
>
>
>----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Message: 1
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 10:30:23 -0500
>From: "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net>
>Subject: Re: re. Sad sight of a Porsche 911. email
>To: <quattro at audifans.com>, "Tom Nas" <tnas at euronet.nl>
>Message-ID: <080901c3cfb3$022b8cd0$6401a8c0 at SWANSONG>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>Right - don't know him or have any prior correspondence AFAIR.
>
>Was curious how he selected to send to me - topic being somewhat relevant,
>since I'm a auto nut, and it is not typical SPAM.
>
>As a side note, I will be sure to insulate my pipes when I install water to
>upstairs of garage!
>
>Ben
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Tom Nas" <tnas at euronet.nl>
>To: <quattro at audifans.com>
>Cc: "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net>
>Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 6:31 AM
>Subject: Re: re. Sad sight of a Porsche 911. email
>
>
> > "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> > >Hey, anyone else receive a message from Windley, William H - ESA
> > ><Windley.William at dol.gov> whom I don't believe I've encountered
> > >before. It was regarding a Sad sight of a Porsche 911. which showed
> > >several cars incl. the Porche covered with a waterfall of ice from
>frozen
> > >pipes that had bursted.
> > >
> > >Just want to make sure there isn't some kind of Virus or worm in the
>JPEG
> > >attached - don't know haow that can be done, but oddly, there were no
> > >receipients specified, and I don't know why he sent this to me
>exclusively or??
> >
> > Do you know this gentleman, does he send attachments to you regularly?
>If
> > not, junk it.
> >
> > Tom
> >
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 2
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 07:42:27 -0800
>From: Nate Beck <Nate.Beck at netiq.com>
>Subject: RE: Seattle Snow!!! Yeahhhh!!!!!!
>To: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID:
> <AED646A35E445846954D6279F1FC241B0267F6 at pdxexch04.us.netiq.corp>
>Content-Type: text/plain
>
>It snowed in Portland last night also. There was about 2 maybe 2 1/2
>inches
>on my coupe this morning when I got up to go to work. It really amazes me
>how people drive in the snow. There are all the large SUV's that barrel
>past you when it is warm outside. But get a little snow on the ground and
>all the large vehicles now go 5 maybe 10 miles an hour. My Coupe is not
>Quattro but still. It is a lot of fun to drive, even in the snow. It is
>not what car you have, but how comfortable you are driving it in those
>conditions. Amazing though....
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: quattro-bounces at audifans.com [mailto:quattro-bounces at audifans.com] On
>Behalf Of David Thoresen
>Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2003 11:06 PM
>To: quattro at audifans.com
>Subject: Seattle Snow!!! Yeahhhh!!!!!!
>
>Well it's snowing at Alki Beach here in Seattle! Woohoo!!!! Got to
>make some fresh tracks with my 90q 20v... yipppeeee! One thing is
>for sure though, I am putting on the stock 14" rims tomorrow morning so
>i don't mess up my 17's if I slide into a curb or something... :D
>
>Happy Happy Joy Joy!
>
>Ciao!
>David
>1990 90q 20v
>
>_______________________________________________
>quattro mailing list
>quattro at audifans.com
>http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 3
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 08:25:19 -0800 (PST)
>From: Dan DiBiase <d_dibiase at yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: I hit a pothole...
>To: Jason Eisenmenger <jason at omglol.com>, urq at audifans.com,
> quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <20031231162519.48373.qmail at web40309.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>In NYC I understand the deal is that if your car is damaged by a reported
>pothole (i.e., someone has notified NYC DOT of it's existance), you can
>get reimbursed for the damage. If unreported, you are SOL. Not sure how
>difficult it is to get reimbursed, however.....
>
>Dan D
>'04 A4 1.8T q MT-6
>Central NJ USA
>
>--- Jason Eisenmenger <jason at omglol.com> wrote:
> > And not just any pothole. After an instant flat, i got out and looked
> > at it. I felt like i was looking into the bottomless pit, or that if i
> > jumped in i would somehow end up in china. This thing was seriously
> > deep. 9 inches deep to be exact. I don't know if it affected my
> > alignment or not, but i sure as hell felt the bottom of my car grinding
> > on the concrete.
> >
> > And this was on a main road pulling out of a fast food restaurant,
> > hidden oh so secretly underneath an innocent little puddle. I don't
> > know about here, but do any cities re-imburse damage done to cars by
> > these? I know they will pay for windshields if a rock comes off the
> > street and cracks it.
> >
> > Either way, the local roads dept. will surely be hearing from me at 8 am
> > sharp tomorrow.
> >
> > Jason
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Find out what made the Top Yahoo! Searches of 2003
>http://search.yahoo.com/top2003
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 4
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 11:36:38 EST
>From: SuffolkD at aol.com
>Subject: Re: Pot hole help on collecting from CT
>To: quattro at audifans.com
>Cc: 200q20v at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <1ac.1ebc10e7.2d245516 at aol.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
>Following a thread on the main quattro list about hitting a pot hole and
>the
>damaged wheel etc....
>
>I found the old "Instructions for filing claims" for CT:
>(1993) Commissioner Dept of Trans.
>24 Wolcott Hill Road
>Wethersfield, Conn 06109
>Attn: Claims Division.
>1. Name adress, phone # of claimant
>2. Account of the accident, date, time, account of incident
>3. Claim made in writing in 90 days.
>Photo in registry for now. Basically, State is liable except for
>construction
>work where the contractor must carry insurance holding state "harmless."
>Town roads are Town roads. State roads and Interstates are State turf.
>http://www.audifans.com/registry2/car_images/56.91.jpg
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 17:43:58 +0100
>From: Per Lindgren <lindgre at online.no>
>Subject: Re: Gas prices - was metric tools
>To: bwpearre at alumni.princeton.edu
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <3FF2FCCE.9030901 at online.no>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
>
>
>
>Benjamin Weste Pearre wrote:
>
> >No, y'all have it much better than I do. Poor me, I pay about $1.70US
> >per gallon.
> >
>
>Ha! Haha! Poor you! Lucky bastid, I pay $5.50 per US gallon for dino
>piss for my Audi. It costs $100 to fill my empty fuel tank!
>
>PerL
>87 Cq
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 11:50:03 -0500
>From: Robert Myers <robert at s-cars.org>
>Subject: Re: Gas prices - was metric tools
>To: Per Lindgren <lindgre at online.no>, bwpearre at alumni.princeton.edu
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.2.20031231114827.0251cec0 at pop.registeredsite.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>Gee, Per, it sounds to me like you should not make it a practice to allow
>the fuel tank to become empty. :-))
>
>At 05:43 PM 12/31/2003 +0100, Per Lindgren wrote:
>
> >Benjamin Weste Pearre wrote:
> >
> >>No, y'all have it much better than I do. Poor me, I pay about $1.70US
> >>per gallon.
> >
> >Ha! Haha! Poor you! Lucky bastid, I pay $5.50 per US gallon for dino piss
> >for my Audi. It costs $100 to fill my empty fuel tank!
> >
> >PerL
> >87 Cq
>
>_____
>
>Stop Mad Cowboy Disease.
>
>Bob
>*****
> Robert L. Myers 304-574-2372
> Rt. 4, Box 57, Fayetteville, WV 25840 USA WV tag Q SHIP
> '95 urS6 Cashmere Grey - der Wunderwagen ICQ 22170244
> http://www.cob-net.org/church/pvcob.htm
>*****
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 7
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 11:49:13 -0500
>From: "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net>
>Subject: Re: CIS-e problems
>To: "Brian Sims" <sims at miliserv.net>
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <084001c3cfbe$050f4ad0$6401a8c0 at SWANSONG>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>[----- Original Message -----
>From: Brian Sims
>To: benswann at comcast.net
>Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 10:49 AM
>Subject: CIS-e problems
> Hello Ben, I have been watching the conversations going on about the
>injection problems. One of my cars had some issues lately that caused me to
>do a fairly comprehensive investigation into the system to correct.Could
>you briefly describe to me the system tests you have done?Perhaps I can
>help you out.
>
> Brian]
>
> Brian,
>
> I have not really done a great deal of troubleshooting so far. After I
>did the CIS-E-3 transplant, I had so much work left to do on the car, I set
>it aside to work on my Ur Quattro. I finally have complete diagnostics
>manual for NG/NF engines, and just need the time to work through. I plan to
>resume this project in few weeks, and then can devote the time to do more
>methodical trouble-shooting I've only needed to start the car to move it
>around every so often, so I just prime the injectors as described below.
>
> In my experience, this is likely injectors leaking down, or some other
>leakdown. After sitting for an undetermined length of time, over 10
>minutes, the engine will not start even after continuous cranking. If I
>jumper the Fuel-Pump to run, and lift the airflow plate to "prime" with
>fuel for a few seconds, the engine starts and runs. This tells me that
>there was no fuel in the lines, and there was a leakdown somewhere. If I
>just jumper the fuel pump to run, the engine will not start - that
>indicates the system is pressurized, but since the airflow plate was not
>lifted, no fuel got in the lines. I think that just cranking the engine is
>not enough to lift the plate and charge the injector lines. Once the
>engine is started, it can be turned off and re-started.
>
> From what I understand, the Cold Start injector line would be the same
>pressure as the other injector lines, and therefore, it is not pressurized
>either. This would be different than the setup on the CIS-E and CIS
>systems, which are full system pressure - correct me if I'm wrong.
>
> Perhaps I'm overlooking something else. I have installed a NG fuel pump
>in the 4000 Quattro that the engine transplanted. Complete CIS-E3 wiring
>and AFAIK everything is hooked up properly.
>
> I'd be glad to hear of any other ideas i may have missed. At present I
>intend to buy injectors and install them to rule this out.
>
> Ben
>
> Overly detailed writeup on the swap:
> http://www.homestead.com/ben_swann/files/GTQswap.txt
>
> and the wiring:
> http://www.homestead.com/ben_swann/NGwiring.html
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 8
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 08:57:36 -0800 (PST)
>From: Steve Meyer <quattroslm at yahoo.com>
>Subject: Re: Any listers in Italy?
>To: Bob <bob at audisport.com>
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <20031231165736.42843.qmail at web61003.mail.yahoo.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>I went through the Ferrari museum about two years ago,
>but I don't recall any factory tour being available.
>But, then again, I was just some kid with a big
>backpack and wide eyes. I decided to hit the factory
>pretty last minute, so with planning you might be able
>to arrange some sort of factory tour. Some beautiful
>cars, even got to see a prototype driving down the
>street. I think a early version of the Enzo, but who
>knows. Have fun!
>
>Steve
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>New Yahoo! Photos - easier uploading and sharing.
>http://photos.yahoo.com/
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 9
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 12:04:16 -0500
>From: "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net>
>Subject: Re: cis-e help!! [NG CIS-E3]
>To: <audi at humanspeakers.com>
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com
>Message-ID: <085001c3cfc0$1fb7de40$6401a8c0 at SWANSONG>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>Huw,
>
>I speculate, that the difference in the CSVs for CIS-e and E3 are operating
>pressures. Probably CIS-e atomizes at full system pressure, and CIS-e at
>regulated pressure. One would have to use the correct injector for that
>system.
>
>I'm just inferring from what has been discussed, and could be way off.
>
>Ben
>
>p.s. if somewone needs, I may have extra lines and c.s. injectors for both
>systems.
>
>p.p.s. I may get into this t-shooting a little sooner since we're on the
>subject.
>
>[I noticve the same thing with the fuel lines on the distributor, the line
>for the csv on the e3 does not match the port from the e system. That was
>the reason I used that distributor, silly me i didn't save the lines from
>the old kx engine.
>
> >Oh, as far as those connectors you mentioned, I'm trying to think of
> >what they might be - the two wires with black booties *sound* like the
> >ones that attach to the afterrun fan sender on the rear of the cam
> >cover, but I'm not certain.
>
>I think your correct about the two loose wires being after run for the fan,
>i seem to recall placing a jumper in between and the fan turning on now
>that
>you mention it. (i've been messing with the wiring for a while so I can't
>exactly remember)
>
>As for the car's exact behaviour from start, It will not idle on its own
>until the car is hot, which takes a few minutes. I went over the vacuum sys
>pretty thoroughly ans i can't seem to find any leaks. the fuel pump is
>noisy
>but it makes good pressure, the lines aren't leaking. Oh, speaking of
>lines,
>the line to the csv has good pressure, fuel squirts like crazy when i crack
>the fitting, but the main five injectors don't seem to get much (leaky
>injectors, bad check valve or accumulator maybe?) Were ok last time i
>fiddled with the car, now nada.
>
> >On the car originally in question, it might make sense to test the CIS
> >temp sender in ice and boiling water to see if it still works right.
>
>On this, i pull it off the car and check resistance, right? Any guidlines
>on
>values i should look for?
>
>Also i looked at a parts catalog last night from europartsdirect.com, the
>CSV from the cis-e and e3, have different part no's. BH007190 For the
>83-87
>coupes and BH007206 for the 87.5's. Is it possible these two parts have a
>different voltage range, so that even if the temp sender is ok it doesn't
>hit the range the injector needs to open?]
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 10
>Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 12:24:20 -0500
>From: "Ben Swann" <benswann at comcast.net>
>Subject: Re: CIS-e problems
>To: "Brian Sims" <sims at miliserv.net>
>Cc: quattro at audifans.com, Ben Swann <benswann at comcast.net>
>Message-ID: <086201c3cfc2$ed3340b0$6401a8c0 at SWANSONG>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>1) Brand new fuel pump for NG engine installed (actually transplanted after
>feew months of successful running on other car that started with a bump of
>the key) Rule out the pump.
>
>2) System is undoubtedly getting full pressure, but may be a leakdown
>somewhere in the distributor itself, so leakdown test in order. I had
>thoroughly cleaned the fuel distributor prior to installation.
>
>3) Yeah - removal of CS injector would tell me it is firing or not. I
>suspect it isn't, because of suspected leakdown, but need to confirm.
>
>I don't think I'll be able to do any of this before next week.
>
>Ben
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Brian Sims
> To: Ben Swann
> Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 12:08 PM
> Subject: Re: CIS-e problems
>
>
> Some quick tests you can do would be a fuel pressure residual pressure
>check( if the pressure stays up) that clears the injectors and if you still
>have a Bosch fuel pump, the check valve.You can check the CSV quickly by
>removing it from the manifold (leave it plugged in)and stick a plug(cork)
>in its place.Place it in a jar while you crank the motor.If you get gas you
>can scratch that.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Ben Swann
> To: Brian Sims
> Cc: quattro at audifans.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 10:49 AM
> Subject: Re: CIS-e problems
>
>
> [----- Original Message -----
> From: Brian Sims
> To: benswann at comcast.net
> Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2003 10:49 AM
> Subject: CIS-e problems
> Hello Ben, I have been watching the conversations going on about the
>injection problems. One of my cars had some issues lately that caused me to
>do a fairly comprehensive investigation into the system to correct.Could
>you briefly describe to me the system tests you have done?Perhaps I can
>help you out.
>
> Brian]
>
> Brian,
>
> I have not really done a great deal of troubleshooting so far.
>After I did the CIS-E-3 transplant, I had so much work left to do on the
>car, I set it aside to work on my Ur Quattro. I finally have complete
>diagnostics manual for NG/NF engines, and just need the time to work
>through. I plan to resume this project in few weeks, and then can devote
>the time to do more methodical trouble-shooting I've only needed to start
>the car to move it around every so often, so I just prime the injectors as
>described below.
>
> In my experience, this is likely injectors leaking down, or some
>other leakdown. After sitting for an undetermined length of time, over 10
>minutes, the engine will not start even after continuous cranking. If I
>jumper the Fuel-Pump to run, and lift the airflow plate to "prime" with
>fuel for a few seconds, the engine starts and runs. This tells me that
>there was no fuel in the lines, and there was a leakdown somewhere. If I
>just jumper the fuel pump to run, the engine will not start - that
>indicates the system is pressurized, but since the airflow plate was not
>lifted, no fuel got in the lines. I think that just cranking the engine is
>not enough to lift the plate and charge the injector lines. Once the
>engine is started, it can be turned off and re-started.
>
> From what I understand, the Cold Start injector line would be the
>same pressure as the other injector lines, and therefore, it is not
>pressurized either. This would be different than the setup on the CIS-E
>and CIS systems, which are full system pressure - correct me if I'm wrong.
>
> Perhaps I'm overlooking something else. I have installed a NG fuel
>pump in the 4000 Quattro that the engine transplanted. Complete CIS-E3
>wiring and AFAIK everything is hooked up properly.
>
> I'd be glad to hear of any other ideas i may have missed. At
>present I intend to buy injectors and install them to rule this out.
>
> Ben
>
> Overly detailed writeup on the swap:
> http://www.homestead.com/ben_swann/files/GTQswap.txt
>
> and the wiring:
> http://www.homestead.com/ben_swann/NGwiring.html
>
>------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>quattro mailing list
>quattro at audifans.com
>http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
>
>
>End of quattro Digest, Vol 2, Issue 212
>***************************************
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