Fuel Pump Relay question

[Chris Hall]

Yeah... I am starting to think it's got something to do with the
wiring for the ISV circuit or something.  I'll have to keep driving
with that disconnected and see what happens.

On 6/4/05, KWSTURTZ <syfer at mindspring.com> wrote:
> Chris Hall wrote:
> 
> >I've pretty much eliminated the hall sender as a problem because when
> >testing the car for another stalling problem, I noticed that
> >disconnecting the hall sender makes the tach drop straight to 0... no
> >backfire, and the tach needle doesn't follow the engine rpms after the
> >stall.
> >
> >Fuel pump relay... I've had to repair it before, and I have gone over
> >it with a magnifying glass.. and I have a 2nd relay that I've swapped
> >in... So that seems fine (although when I was having the relay
> >problem, the symptoms were VERY much like this one... only difference
> >being the car would sometimes run and just run ROUGH as if the "spare
> >fuse" was missing)
> >
> >I think the backfire problem could be the possibility of arching
> >between the spark plug wires... firing the wrong plugs off at the
> >wrong time, etc.  Seems logical, right?  I mean... I relpaced the cap
> >and rotor, and the car ran FINE all week finally.  Then last night,
> >the first humid conditions this year in Chicago, the stalling /
> >occasional backfire happens, and the only part of the chain that I
> >didn't replace (the wires) could possibly produce those symptoms.  The
> >cap and rotor definatly helped a LOT... so I think by trying these new
> >wires I'm still heading in the same direction that I was with the new
> >Cap and Rotor.
> >
> >The only thing that doesn't seem to sit right with me is the fact that
> >the car just won't "catch" after the stalls.  I always mess around
> >under the hood, and 10 min later or so, it starts perfect like
> >nothing's wrong.  I've even switched ECUs in this time period, and no
> >change.  I have a new (non bosch) ignition control module in the car,
> >so I don't think that's a problem... although it could be acting up
> >and over-heating, then cooling off as I sit for 10 minutes.  The only
> >thing is, I had a bad coil that was burning those things up, and they
> >NEVER caused a backfire, and they ALWAYS caused the tach to drop
> >straight to 0... so I don't think that's the problem...
> >
> >I might just try disconnecting the CSV if the problem continues to see
> >if maybe it's leaking fuel in.  Maybe I'll yank the old one out of my
> >83 or something...
> >
> >Haven't been driving the car long enough to see what the fuel
> >situation is like.  With gas being $2.50 a gallon or whatever, every
> >car I drive seems to be getting crappy gas mile
> >age  lol .
> >
> >
> >I'll try that 15 sec cycle you spoke of.  I kinda tried it WITH the
> >relay in, thinking maybe if the fuel pump or system wasn't at proper
> >pressure, I could build up pressure by cyling the pump on with each
> >turn of the key to build pressure.
> >
> >I miss my 83.  No electronic fuel pressure regulator.  No temp sensor
> >for the ECU... not nearly as many vacuum hoses....
> >
> >I guess the more parts you have, the more can go wrong.  Maybe I'll
> >ditch the engine, go buy 42 car batteries and some electric motors and
> >turn it EV  lol.
> >
> >I'll keep ya posted.
> >
> >Thanks.
> >
> >On 6/4/05, Jim Jordan <superba at comcast.net> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>Hi Chris,
> >>
> >>Have you looked at the Hall Sensor?  I don't recall it being mentioned.
> >>They used to be rather fragile and easy to break making their function
> >>intermittent.
> >>
> >>What is strange is that you were able to accumulate enough raw fuel in the
> >>muffler area to cause a backfire.  Have you tried unplugging the cold start
> >>valve?  (if there is one).
> >>
> >>One more thought.  The next time your engine stalls, unplug the fuel pump
> >>relay entirely and turn over the engine for about a minute.  Do it ~15
> >>seconds on, ~15 seconds off to keep from overheating the starter motor.  See
> >>if that clears your engine, and if it does, it means that your fuel delivery
> >>is faulty, injectors, air flow, all cold start valves.
> >>
> >>It might be dumb to ask, but have you noticed that you're using a lot more
> >>fuel than before the problem started?
> >>
> >>Perhaps it's time to have someone else take a look;  a fresh eye often sees
> >>things that we've overlooked.
> >>
> >>Cheers!
> >>
> >>Jim Jordan
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: Kent McLean [mailto:kentmclean at mindspring.com]
> >>> Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2005 6:00 AM
> >>> To: Chris Hall
> >>> Cc: quattro at audifans.com
> >>> Subject: Re: Fuel Pump Relay question
> >>>
> >>> Chris Hall wrote:
> >>>  > ... I'm wondering if the plug wires are arching.  I'd
> >>> LIKE to do the  > "spray bottle" test, but 85% of my plug
> >>> wires are in that loom that  > mounts to the valve cover, so
> >>> the problem could be hidden in there...
> >>>
> >>> The weakness in the wires will more than likely be at the
> >>> ends, by the spark plug and distributor terminals.
> >>> So wait for a dark night and spray those areas, and don't
> >>> worry about what is under the cover.
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Kent McLean
> >>> '94 100 S Avant, "Moody"
> >>> '89 200 TQ, "Bad Puppy" up in smoke
> >>> '56 Austin-Healey 100 BN2, for sale
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> You know i had almost that (except it did not backfire) same problem one
> time on my 200... When i had A STALL  it would do the same start for a
> second then die you toch the gas forget it  for about 10 - 15 minits
> then would start .
> Turned out to be a heat sensor problem the connector was very coroded
> put new connector on and starts ok .
> 
> I also had a stall problem on my 86 5000 turns out i had a bad fuel pump
> filter / screen was some kinda recall were screen at bottom of fuel pump
> had to be removed.
> 
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-- 
Chris Hall
badcomrade at gmail.com
"making girls cry since 1974"