quattro Digest, Vol 135, Issue 10

Sat Jan 10 13:04:30 PST 2015

If it ran fine in ambient temperature then it's unlikely an air leak as it normally won't run very well at all with air in it,regardless off temperature. So if it ran fine then unlikely to be fuel distributor boot or connections. ..however there is one pipe to aux air valve which keeps idle high when cold.

If the problem is cold start, there are normally two reasons for this. The cold start injector is defective or thermotime switch isn't operating correctly. These control the extra fuelling required for very cold starts and it won't start without that. If the fuel pressure accumulator isn't to great either, this hampers cold start as well, even though it's there for keeping pressure on hot starts. When accumulator and cold start injector combine...it most certainly won't start coldl

Hope that helps..,

Sent from my iPad

> On Jan 10, 2015, at 8:00 PM, quattro-request at audifans.com wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold (David Michael)
>   2. RE: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold (patrick gillen)
>   3. Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold (ekellock at gmail.com)
>   4. Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold (John Larson)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2015 07:38:28 -0500
> From: David Michael <adavidmichael at gmail.com>
> To: patrick gillen <pat_gillen at msn.com>
> Cc: "<quattro at audifans.com>" <quattro at audifans.com>
> Subject: Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold
> Message-ID: <8A050A5F-0363-40DC-B7F5-817FFAB8B026 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=us-ascii
> 
> Patrick
> 
> You need to remove the fender liner to get access to all the bits inside the rf fender.
> 
> Read Scott Mockery's site and search on cold start. Bentley also has a section on hard starting. Usually it a vacuum leak. Some common sources - injector seals, oil breather hose ( side of engine), cracked igloo. 
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Dave (now audi-less after 18 years with a 200)
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jan 8, 2015, at 3:14 PM, patrick gillen <pat_gillen at msn.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I was wondering about that as we had to take the fuel distributor boot off
>> to do a clutch job last summer and it has run fine until the weather got
>> colder.  
>> How in the sam hill does one get into the rf fender where all those mystery
>> parts are? On putting it back together back then I fumbled around and think
>> I got the large vacuum hose somewhat reconnected to whatever but I can't be
>> sure how well as not even braile could be used. I asked the son to look in
>> the wheel well the other day for an access panel and he saw none but I
>> should take a look.  Any tidbits beyond pulling the fuel distributor/all
>> injectors and kid glove handling all vs breaking all the rotted fuel hoses
>> so another one burns to the ground?
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2015 07:18:14 -0800
> From: patrick gillen <pat_gillen at msn.com>
> To: "'David Michael'" <adavidmichael at gmail.com>
> Cc: quattro at audifans.com
> Subject: RE: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold
> Message-ID: <BLU180-DS5E0E59AEEB48410700ABBFA450 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> Thanks for the tips, all. I need to look into how to remove that fender
> liner to find/verify those buried mystery hose connections; looks like a
> major chore from Etka. I'll start with the fender I guess.
> 
> Pat
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Michael [mailto:adavidmichael at gmail.com] 
> Sent: January 10, 2015 4:38 AM
> To: patrick gillen
> Cc: <quattro at audifans.com>
> Subject: Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold
> 
> Patrick
> 
> You need to remove the fender liner to get access to all the bits inside the
> rf fender.
> 
> Read Scott Mockery's site and search on cold start. Bentley also has a
> section on hard starting. Usually it a vacuum leak. Some common sources -
> injector seals, oil breather hose ( side of engine), cracked igloo. 
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Dave (now audi-less after 18 years with a 200)
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Jan 8, 2015, at 3:14 PM, patrick gillen <pat_gillen at msn.com> wrote:
>> 
>> I was wondering about that as we had to take the fuel distributor boot 
>> off to do a clutch job last summer and it has run fine until the 
>> weather got colder.
>> How in the sam hill does one get into the rf fender where all those 
>> mystery parts are? On putting it back together back then I fumbled 
>> around and think I got the large vacuum hose somewhat reconnected to 
>> whatever but I can't be sure how well as not even braile could be 
>> used. I asked the son to look in the wheel well the other day for an 
>> access panel and he saw none but I should take a look.  Any tidbits 
>> beyond pulling the fuel distributor/all injectors and kid glove 
>> handling all vs breaking all the rotted fuel hoses so another one burns to
> the ground?
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2015 16:11:03 +0000
> From: <ekellock at gmail.com>
> To: "=?utf-8?Q?cobram at juno.com?=" <cobram at juno.com>,
>    "=?utf-8?Q?viejoloco at comcast.net?=" <viejoloco at comcast.net>
> Cc: "=?utf-8?Q?quattro at audifans.com?=" <quattro at audifans.com>
> Subject: Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold
> Message-ID: <54b14f6b.d3886b0a.5b82.37b0 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> I had the exact same thing happen with the valve at the fuel pump on my 89 200q. I went in expecting to replace it and found that it was just loose. Tightened it up and all was well. 
> 
> 
> Ed
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: cobram at juno.com
> Sent: ‎Thursday‎, ‎January‎ ‎8‎, ‎2015 ‎11‎:‎09‎ ‎AM
> To: viejoloco at comcast.net
> Cc: quattro at audifans.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I had a similar thing happen on the 200TQA many moons ago.  After much
> diagnosis and shotgunning, it turned out to be the fuel return valve at
> the fuel pump was a bit loose or defective and would lose pressure when
> the car sat.  
> 
> 
> I found a copy of my old post about this:
> 
> "When the return valve was loose, it took a whole lot more than 5 seconds
> to start, and wouldn't start at all depending on whether the engine was
> up to operating temperature or not.  That one was a btch to figure out,
> since the valve was failing intermittently, and would test fine.  
> Check valve is something everyone should keep as a spare when you change
> fuel pumps (usually get a new one with fuel pump), I think it was around
> $35 as a separate item, and if you have one on hand, it's probably faster
> to just change for a known good one than to test it."
> 
> BCNU,
> Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes
> 
> John Larson <viejoloco at comcast.net> writes:
> 
>> Cold meaning "sitting until the engine is at ambient 
>> temperature".  To answer another post, the fuel pump runs when the 
>> car 
>> is in a cranking situation.  Fuel pressures appear to be normal.  
>> I'll 
>> confirm that this morning.  Temps here are currently about 60 
>> degrees.
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
> http://www.audifans.com/kb/List_information
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Sat, 10 Jan 2015 11:53:27 -0800
> From: John Larson <viejoloco at comcast.net>
> To: ekellock at gmail.com, "cobram at juno.com" <cobram at juno.com>
> Cc: "quattro at audifans.com" <quattro at audifans.com>
> Subject: Re: '87 5KCSTQ reluctant to start cold
> Message-ID: <54B18337.5090809 at comcast.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
>> On 1/10/2015 8:11 AM, ekellock at gmail.com wrote:
>> I had the exact same thing happen with the valve at the fuel pump on 
>> my 89 200q. I went in expecting to replace it and found that it was 
>> just loose. Tightened it up and all was well.
>> 
>> Ed
>> 
>> *From:* cobram at juno.com <mailto:cobram at juno.com>
>> *Sent:* ‎Thursday‎, ‎January‎ ‎8‎, ‎2015 ‎11‎:‎09‎ ‎AM
>> *To:* viejoloco at comcast.net <mailto:viejoloco at comcast.net>
>> *Cc:* quattro at audifans.com <mailto:quattro at audifans.com>
>> 
>> I had a similar thing happen on the 200TQA many moons ago.  After much
>> diagnosis and shotgunning, it turned out to be the fuel return valve at
>> the fuel pump was a bit loose or defective and would lose pressure when
>> the car sat.
>> 
>> 
>> I found a copy of my old post about this:
>> 
>> "When the return valve was loose, it took a whole lot more than 5 seconds
>> to start, and wouldn't start at all depending on whether the engine was
>> up to operating temperature or not.  That one was a btch to figure out,
>> since the valve was failing intermittently, and would test fine.
>> Check valve is something everyone should keep as a spare when you change
>> fuel pumps (usually get a new one with fuel pump), I think it was around
>> $35 as a separate item, and if you have one on hand, it's probably faster
>> to just change for a known good one than to test it."
>> 
>> BCNU,
>> Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes
>> 
>> John Larson <viejoloco at comcast.net> writes:
>> 
>>> Cold meaning "sitting until the engine is at ambient
>>> temperature".  To answer another post, the fuel pump runs when the
>>> car
>>> is in a cranking situation.  Fuel pressures appear to be normal.
>>> I'll
>>> confirm that this morning.  Temps here are currently about 60
>>> degrees.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> quattro mailing list
>> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/quattro
>> http://www.audifans.com/kb/List_information
> Good idea, but my system holds pressure.  Update;  The test for the temp 
> switch is to compare it with a known good one.  They're cheap, and 
> Autohausaz had one for cheqap, so I'm awaiting its arrival.
> 
> John
> 
> 
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> ------------------------------
> 
> End of quattro Digest, Vol 135, Issue 10
> ****************************************