[s-cars] Re: brake conversions for 200q20v - wilwood (& I'm gone)

[Brett Dikeman]

Keith said:

>  >  Do you have test data to back that up? FYI, the dominate
>>  brake in all levels of NASCAR is Wilwood. The top classes
>>  have a minimum race weight of 3800lbs, are limited to a 15"
>>  wheel, and the hand built chassis can cost over $100,000.
>>  These cars race on road courses, superspeedways, and 1/2 mile
>>  ovals for up to 600 miles. Now with those requirements why
>>  would owners like Roush, Yates, Penske, and Childress, who
>>  can afford any brake in the world, equip their cars with an
>>  inferior product? Subject $100,000 race cars to hazard to
>>  save a few hundred dollars? Put the safety of drivers at risk
>>  for the same reason? Please explain this, I'm dying to hear
>  > your expert opinion on the subject.
>>


Has anyone ever looked at the complete -crap- that Nascar drivers and
teams recommend?  They recommend, wear, drink, and eat ANYTHING that
pays the bills.  NASCAR fans are so numerous that NASCAR
merchandising and sponsorship is an ENORMOUS business...the sport has
turned into a bunch of 200mph billboards.  When I hit a NASCAR race
on TV once by accident, they were showing computer generated
#'s/sponsor logos above each car!

To quote NASCAR for safety/reliability is hilarious. NASCAR started
as a bunch of moonshine runners.  Back in the early days, NASCAR went
through drivers like a chain smoker goes through cigarettes...and
even recently, it took the death of a major player to get new safety
rules into the books(and I believe most teams didn't do squat until
nascar changed the rulebook, but I could be wrong;  I don't exactly
follow this sort of stuff.)

Same thing to say that NASCAR's equipment selections are "the best."
Those people who make engine additives get the nascar teams to sign
on.  Sure, they -may- actually use it, since the engine's getting
tossed in the trash after a few races anyway...how many average joes
take out their engine every 2000 miles and dump it in the trash and
install a new one?  I change my -oil- every 5000 miles.  NASCAR teams
change CARS quicker than that.

NASCAR may race the ovals for 600 miles and blah blah blah...but they
do so on track surfaces which bear no resemblance to real world
driving...and everything on the car gets stripped down.  I'm guessing
those calipers are benched after every race, thoroughly examined for
damage, new seals, etc etc.  If something improves performance
on-track but needs more maintenance at the end of the day, so be it.

Do you strip down your brakes after 600 miles?  I don't.  I pulled my
rear brakes apart after 60,000+ miles(that would be 100x longer,
thanks very much.)  I live in NE where roads are in horrible shape,
I've got some dirt roads near the house I used to take on a daily
basis...and we've got lovely things like road salt etc.  I don't know
too many nascar vehicles that operate on sanded+salted slushy roads.

   One piston was cosmetically scratched(fixed with some very light
sanding with 600-grit paper followed by a metal polish) and had some
sort of paste residue which needed removal...but neither was
rusted(oops, thats right, I forgot, Audi pistons are chromed, not
stainless) or damaged beyond repair; the dust boots did their jobs.
Did I mention that one piston was extended quite a bit because the
rotor+pads were both severely worn?

Now, for the icing on the cake, Keith.  Have you ever taken to
studying the manufacturer's recommendations for the systems you're
supposedly expert in, after giving Michael a lashing?  Apparently not.


"CALIPER REBUILDING:
If you race on dirt or drag race on a weekly basis throughout the
year, you should disassemble your calipers mid-season and inspect the
caliper seals for excessive wear or hardness caused by heat. Asphalt
racers generally experience more heat and should do inspections more
frequently, especially after racing on a track where high
temperatures are reached. NASCAR's Winston Cup, Busch GN, Craftsman
Truck and Road Race teams usually replace caliper seals after each
race to ensure proper disc brake performance. Disassembly and
replacement of the seals is a simple process and can prevent
catastrophic brake failure.
"

(pasted from http://www.wilwood.com/products/calipers/calipertech.asp)

Furthermore, I can't help but notice that Wilwood continuously
mentions that they make RACING products throughout their website.
Take a look at:
http://www.wilwood.com/products/calipers/calipers.asp

Seems that they go out of their way to talk about applications in
various types of racing...and they don't do a whole lot of talking
about daily drivers -anywhere- on the site.

Everyone I've ever heard about talk about Wilwoods has said the same
thing: cheaper, lighter, but high maintenance and for those that do
little more than drive the car on track and have the time to do
regular brake overhauls.

Brett
--
----
"They that give up essential liberty to obtain temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Ben Franklin
http://www.users.cloud9.net/~brett/