[s-cars] 80tq: Dyno Run Update

[JShadzi at aol.com]

Hey Mike...

>Javad - do you have any guess as to how your numbers might scale if boost
>were pushed to @ 26 to 27 psi?  

Well, not sure, but if I was guessing I'd say somewhere in the 350whp range, hard to say though, it would take pure 100octane for sure, and I'm just not sure if the current 10v motor can take it flow wise.  I have a build up 2.3 that I ported and cammed, that should be going in by the Fall, that motor I will push harder as well, my goal is 300whp with under 20psi.

Also, not sure how comb. chamber dynamics play into it, but I feel that the 20v likely has a better comb. chamber for pushing higher power #'s (aside from flow), as well as its better cooled with the water manifold configuration, I think this is a real weakness of the 10v motor.

>I see the torque and hp peaks were located
>at @ 4,300 and 6,100 rpm.  Does the dyno you use also provide a boost chart
>to go with the torque / hp curves?

No, but my boost is very stable, in the peak run it was at 17 by about 4krpm, and maybe crept up to like 17.5 by 6krpm, its rock solid, no overboost strategies or anything like that yet, though I will experiment with some of that using the new ECU to control boost.

>Hap has seen @ 404 SAE peak hp at the wheels with his set up, but that's
>pushing, IIRC, @ 26 to 27 psi at the peak which, IIRC was some where in the
>4200~4400 rpm range.  

Yes, that's a lot of pressure, plus he's flowing through the 20v head, which flows about 40% better right out of the box than a stock 10v head, which is basically what I'm running currently.

>For some unknown reason :-), his turbo seems to be
>able to keep up with that kind of delivery volume level even as his rpm
>rises past 6500 rpm.

Yes, I'm running basically the same turbo as he is, good turbos, you can see that power isn't too peaky, and very flat and stable, this is what makes fast cars, not peaky torque and power curves.

>I take it the -1 psi, but +26 hp in the latest run over you August 2002
>results must be largely attributed to the new, "Stage II" intercooler setup?

Yes, and better timing maps I'd say, I also removed the 3" diesel cat, but not sure how much that really helped.

>FWIW, we hope to see if there is a measurable difference between the
>attached ....

Cool, very nice, that should flow a lot better than the other core, I'd like to know how this works for you, keep me posted.

>well, sometime.  What were the dimensions on the previous
>Stage 1 IC?

It was 17.5" long, 7" tall, 3" thick, bout RS2 sized.  Had 10 rows in it.

>It looks to me like your stage II version now has @ 21 charge
>air passages in it, vs. @ 10 if I'm counting correctly in the earlier
>version.  Core "flow" lengths look to be about the same, ? 19"?

Lengths are about the same, 19 vs 17.5, yes, this core flows about 600cfm or so, on the road I get about 1dC of heat increase at the IC outlet through to 5th gear.

>In any event, congratulations.

Thanks, I appreciate it... my intention isn't, and never has been, "ohh, look at how much power I can make on the dyno".  In a recent Sport Compact Car issue, they dragged like 4 modded WRX's, ironically, the car that made the most dyno power, like 50 more whp than the nearest car, was the 3rd fastest car, it just wasn't driveable.

As a tuner, you really need to avoid the temptation to make good "paper #'s" and ignore real world driveability, etc.  What I'd like to demonstrate is that you can take a cheap 10v motor, run 91 octane street gas, and make over 200whp with a $1k EFI system and some other sensible mods, a car that will accelerate violently in any gear over 3krpm.  My 80 weights under 3klbs, so 300+ crank hp goes a long way to making some serious speed.

I've gotten some replies that have stated, "well, this guy or that guy made this much running 25psi and Nitrous" and other BS.  Comparing things in a rational, relative way, 256hp on 17psi is an accomplishment I'm proud of, the car is reliable, driveable, and very fast, its never been my intention to create some quarter mile drag hog, this is a fast road car, so that's what I'm pushing for.

In the future, I would like to push the boost envelope more to see just "what she'll do", for the fun of it, but I think many out there are wayy to impressed with #'s and loose sight of what tuning a car is really about.

Anyway, I'll be drag racing it this weekend, I'll give an update there too.

Thanks,
Javad