[s-cars] S4 Chip

[mlp qwest]

Well Dave, first the chip often isn't the "only" variable in the system.
Even if everything is operating "right" how do you know if it is running
optimally right.  My impression is that in the tuning business, MTM/Hoppen
try to control for this by working off a very specific list of parts, which
they want/will supply all of, in a combination they have approved of.  There
is nothing wrong with that approach, in fact it's commendable if you think
of the whole process as one integrated system.  OTOH, a good number of folks
going with chips find themselves either straying off the integrated systems
approach, or sourcing components over time from different parties, in which
case something like MTM/Hoppen's one stop shopping & chip selection format
starts to break down.

2nd, there have been a number of instances IIRC, some even posted on the
list, of chips that, for one reason or another, weren't installed correctly
or for some other reason failed to operate properly.  Some tuners have stood
out by offering "loaner" boards etc., to keep a listers car on the road
while the problem was sorted out.  Others ...., well you might find your
self on your own.  I think Hoppen had a spate (more than one) of either bad
Eprom or poor R&R jobs.  It was their 2nd supplier, people like Anderson
IIRC, that stepped up to the plate with a loaner box etc. to keep the
customer happy while the problem was worked out

3rd, you can't always trust your SOPD (seat of the pants dyno), Yes it may
feel like you got a performance boost from the chip, but how many on the
list have been driving about, some for quite some time "thinking" things
were working just fine, till they got into a friends well sorted out car and
..... ;-(

Finally, FWIW, yes I've seen and driven several of the "cookie box cutter"
one size fits all chip set ups.  Some of them run really well, but......
Personally, I think there are better choices out there.  An anecdote, we had
a fallen brethren here in Colorado with a well modified UrS4, who found
himself lusting for a P***ch 993tt.   He had some acquaintances who owned
one and offered to let him take if for a spin.  On Colo S-Mafia lunch day,
they came by and the lost lamb took the 993 out for a run.  His comment when
he came back was, "Well, its nice etc. but it just doesn't feel as fast as
my S4."  It sure didn't look that way when he pulled out of the KT
Bar-b-Que's parking lot.  My guess was he was confusing (sorry Elijah) that
RS2 turbos sudden "kick" in the back as it comes on line after @ 3200 rpm
with, the immediate, relentless and unremitting solid acceleration that the
993 puts out form 0 mph in stock form.  He bought a 993.

Finally, a lot of the is a matter of personal choice, preferences and the
fact that some of those alternatives have been more readily available to me
given where I'm located etc.  My 2 cents is the only way able to get an
objective assessment of the relative power levels of two different sets of
chips etc. is to put both cars side by side and have them do a 3rd or 4th
gear pull from say @ 15-20 mph to where ever 6500 rpm puts you.

HTH
Mike

~-----Original Message-----
~From: Dave Forgie

~
~Mike and Rich: If a chip is "good" (or great) why does it need support?
~Isn't it "sorted" before you spend your $$$ on it?  Unless you are doing
~something out of the ordinary (say K26/Garrett hybrid), then I might
~understand the need for 'support', otherwise, I  wouldn't want to buy or
~recommend anybody's "science project".
~
~Dave F.
~