[s-cars] Re: Big Red Rear Brakes

Tue Oct 21 09:35:29 EDT 2003

Fred,

Don't know the ratios maybe I'll look them up tonight, but the BTDT UrS4
track car i was referring to has a coil-over full-race suspension.

Must be all that power you have, and late-braking enthusiasm to lose your
2xBR brakes in 14 laps! or...what kind of pad are you running at track? full
race/hi-temp pad?

Leigh
----- Original Message -----
From: "Frederic L'Huillier" <flhuilli at hotmail.com>
To: <leigha at teleport.com>; <s-car-list at audifans.com>
Sent: Monday, October 20, 2003 3:05 AM
Subject: Re: Big Red Rear Brakes

> Leigh,
>
> Yes they are. I know the suspension upgrade had an positive impact. The
rear
> used to dance a bit on the track under hard braking. It doesn't anymore.
> To give you a comparison. At Charade Race Track, a stock RS4 can do 5-6
laps
> maximun. I did 14 before loosing brakes. I am considering installing the
> brakes ducts of the RS2 on my car for our next track event
>
> I don't know the weight distribution between Avant and Sedan so I can't
> tell. If you have the ratios I will be interested.
>
> Frederic
>
> >From: "Leigh Anderson" <leigha at teleport.com>
> >To: "Frederic L'Huillier"
<flhuilli at hotmail.com>,<s-car-list at audifans.com>
> >Subject: Re: Big Red Rear Brakes
> >Date: Tue, 21 Oct 2003 00:59:16 -0700
> >
> >Hi Fred,
> >
> >Are the rear BRs on your beautiful blue V8 S6 avant?  i wonder if
> >later/more
> >advanced ESP and more advanced ABS as well as larger contact patch
(265m!)
> >have something to do with your better results (vs. early '90's UrS?).
Also
> >i
> >think the Avant has better weight distribution so the rears would have
more
> >grip at the contact patch.
> >
> >yep,YMMV!
> >
> >Leigh
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Frederic L'Huillier" <flhuilli at hotmail.com>
> >To: <leigha at teleport.com>; <s-car-list at audifans.com>
> >Sent: Sunday, October 19, 2003 11:47 PM
> >Subject: Re: [s-cars] Re: Big Red Rear Brakes
> >
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > As I have the BR on 4 wheels on my car, I will drop a few words on
this
> > > topic:
> > >
> > > Yes it does make a difference in term of performance. To a point where
a
> > > Lotus Elise on track was pretty close to damage my rear bumper ! Jim
> >Klein
> > > from California drove my car a few weeks ago and he confirmed it is
much
> > > better than just the front BR.
> > >
> > > I believe Movit HQ did only one car: Mine. Actually it used to be on
> >their
> > > web site under the S4 section. It is not there anymore. The previous
> >owner
> > > told me that Movit had to do a lot of work to make the rear BR work
> > > properly. A lot of parts had to be made for the rear BR. Because the
> > > previous owner owned a couple of sport car magazines, Movit did it. It
> >would
> > > have been you or me, they would not have done it ! I have checked
> >recently
> > > for other French Audi Club member and received a huge No More !
> > > I am waiting the estimation of the value of those BRs for my
insurance.
> >The
> > > bill is at least 10000 dollars.
> > >
> > > You need a sport suspension to keep up with such brakes system. I had
my
> > > Bilstein rebuilt to a much harder setup. In term of tires, I do have
> >265/35
> > > x 18.
> > >
> > > My 0,002 old Francs
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Frederic
> > >
> > >
> > > >From: "Leigh Anderson" <leigha at teleport.com>
> > > >To: <s-car-list at audifans.com>
> > > >Subject: [s-cars] Re: Big Red Rear Brakes
> > > >Date: Mon, 20 Oct 2003 10:06:04 -0700
> > > >
> > > >Hi Todd,
> > > >
> > > >I have a few thoughts, btdt for putting big brakes on back of an
> >UrS6...
> > > >I'm skeptical of the performance benefits for such a front-heavy car
as
> > > >ours, but if motivation is 'cause they look great... thats cool, go
for
> >it,
> > > >being a big brake fanatic myself.  But I just couldn't justify the
> >expense
> > > >for myself for functional reasons.
> > > >
> > > >btdt/background: For hard braking anywhere/track use especially, i
> >predict
> > > >the best setup will be to use a brake bias control and defeat almost
> >all
> >of
> > > >the BR rear brake's capability. my BTDT is an UrS4 track car with
> >mov'it
> > > >BR's up front (works great and much better than smaller P-car (968)
> >brakes
> > > >that PO put on), and P-car brakes on rear (968) installed by PO,
> >smaller
> > > >than the 993tt rears, but much bigger than stock UrS rears. When i
> >tried
> >a
> > > >few laps set even 1/3 to rear, it was truly scary/dangerous, the car
> >was
> > > >skittering/jittering all over, very un-nerving, with lots of
> >quick-steering
> > > >inputs to keep it semi-straight and ABS helping as much as it could
but
> >not
> > > >nearly enuf. As soon as i slapped the control back to full-front, the
> >car
> > > >was rock-solid, much more usable/powerful straight-line braking
> >resulted.
> > > >I
> > > >experimented a few more laps doing a-b testing and came to a firm
> > > >conclusion, at least for that car.
> > > >
> > > >Also note the usual pad life (long) of rear pads vs. front pads under
> > > >street
> > > >or track condition. My R4S street compound pad lasts a long long time
> >at
> > > >rear thru street and track use.
> > > >
> > > >so my 2cents is... if function is the goal, consider not to do it,
save
> > > >money for a more functional perf upgrade.  If aesthetics is the goal,
> >go
> > > >for
> > > >it, but most likely expect to be defeating the rears with a
> > > >brake-positioning valve for safety reasons.
> > > >
> > > >pardon if my 2 cents is obvious, as the reference in Todd's post
> >already
> > > >says "Some strong words of advice: *-Altering the brake system on
your
> >car
> > > >may be dangerous, and the front/rear brake ratio should be checked
> >after
> > > >modifications. A wrong setup results in locking the rear wheels prior
> >of
> > > >the
> > > >front wheels which is dangerous. I strongly recommend the
installation
> >of
> > > >an
> > > >adjustable proportional valve instead of the original one, or at
least
> > > >check
> > > >the front/rear ratio with the stock valve."
> > > >
> > > >Cheers,
> > > >Leigh
> > > >street car: '92 UrS4 with...
> > > >    Front: Mov'It BR's, Porterfield R4 pad for track, Porsche street
> >pad
> > > >(R1
> > > >slicks for track)
> > > >    Rear:Audi stock caliper rear, R4S pad for track or street,
2Bennett
> > > >drilled rotor (R1 slicks for track)
> > > >
> > > >P.S.  note the benefits of <clipped> posting.  I see too many
unclipped
> > > >posts, one reason i participate less than in past years... it gets
> >tiresome
> > > >'wearing out my scroll button' going through digest emails looking
for
> > > >msg#n
> > > >
> > > >----- Original Message ----- >
> > > >Message: 1
> > > > > From: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>
> > > > > To: <CaptMagu at aol.com>
> > > > > Cc: "s-car-list" <s-car-list at audifans.com>
> > > > > Date: Sat, 18 Oct 2003 21:04:40 -0600
> > > > > Subject: [s-cars] Big Red Rear Brakes
> > > >
> > > > > Hap,
> > > > >
> > > > > Send me the pic/pics.  I too am so close to a big red rear brake
> > > >solution
> > > >t=
> > > > > hat it isn't funny ... I am simply an emergency brake cable away
> >from
> > > >using=
> > > > >  the actual RS2 setup with the internal Porsche drums.  The master
> > > >cylinder=
> > > > >  capacity is my only concern, but my techs in Germany assure me
that
> >the
> > > >Ur=
> > > > > S MC is up to the task.
> > > > >
> > > > > My biggest hurdle was the centering disk to keep the 993TT rear
> >rotor
> > > >prope=
> > > > > rly centered, but my OZ Futura's have an integrated removable
spacer
> > > >that
> > > >w=
> > > > > ill soon be cut to handle the task.
> > > > >
> > > > > This old link
> > > >http://www.s-cars.org/urs4s6/faq/f008/RS2_e-brake/rs2_e-brake=
> > > > > _4.html has been the inspiration, but I think Joern was using a
true
> >Big
> > > >Re=
> > > > > d front caliper in his mod.
> > > > >
> > > > > .=2E.and now that I hear the Lincoln LS uses and electronic
acutator
> >on
> > > >the=
> > > > > ir e-brake, the cables may no longer be the long pole in this
tent.
> > > > >
> > > > > Todd Kramer
> > > > > '95 S6
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >_______________________________________________
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> > >
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> >
> >
>
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