[s-cars] RS2 "Killer" dyno results

[Djdawson2 at aol.com]

In a message dated 8/17/2004 11:59:40 AM Mountain Daylight Time, 
gary.m.lewis2 at boeing.com writes:

> Gary is saying:
> I find the above comment interesting in that a "Stock" RS2 KKK performed
> so well in relation to a modded Garrett product.  Your numbers seem to
> be saying that perhaps KKK isn't so bad after all, in spite of all the
> bad press they seem to get on performance websites. 


Dave replies:
I don't think the RS2 is a bad unit at all... in fact, it does quite well.  
My point is that I believe a better option can be developed within the Garrett 
hybrid world.  I completely enjoyed my RS2 stuff for quite some time... caught 
more than a few WRX pilots by surprise...

> 
> 
> Gary is saying:
> I am on the path to do the same thing.  Goal is to find a turbo that is
> better than RS2, less expensive, specifically for an RS2 modded car
> with stock IC, that bolts in with NO MODS.  I think the closest turbo
> you/we are looking for is in my car and Cody's car.  Look at his dyno
> numbers (317hp and 380 tq on a VERY screwed up motor).  I think with the
> exception of low rpm boost (I make about 10 psi at 2,600 rpm, and 26 psi
> at 3,400 rpm), this turbo is there.  I am in the process of modifying my
> turbo to improve low end response.  I will let you know how it goes.
> And it is bone stock in terms of installation, anyone who can remove
> their stock turbo can put this one in.


Dave replies:
I can appreciate your perspective.  Until Cody gets his car back on the dyno, 
we're left guessing.  My engine (325/401 on same dyno) was also in poor 
shape.  How bad either engine was, and what that did to our numbers is pure 
speculation... as Cody hasn't been back to the dyno, and mine won't be reassembled to 
the same spec.

WRT boost threshold... unfortunately, we're dealing with different 
conditions.  As Chad Clark pointed out yesterday, the altitude changes things 
considerably.  In fact, Chad recently did a little info gathering on his car, and 
reported that it took between 3100 and 3300rpm (outside temp dependent) to develop 
15psi in his car using a stock K24.

AFA installation goes... I'm not too concerned about the water/oil line 
issue.  It is so simple to deal with, that I consider it a non-issue.  And if you 
aren't stuck on using SS lines, it is very affordable.

> 
> Thanks for sharing all your data, I appreciate firsthand all that it
> takes to do these types on tuning sessions.  This isn't a slam, just a
> nudge!  Looking to expand minds (including my own...)...
> 
> 

I hear what you're saying, and I don't feel slammed.  I've just decided to 
head down the Garrett path.  Certainly on my own cars, I've elected to go "full" 
Garrett by having my headers built with T3 flanges.  I believe it gives me 
more options than I can have with KKK.  I can drive 20 minutes, and be at a shop 
fully equipped to build any (Garrett) turbo I want to try.  There's something 
to be said for that.

I appreciate your info as well.  There are so many possibilities for these 
engines, and apparently very little documentation available regarding mods.  So 
I'm left with questions like:
1) Is a Stromung or other aftermarket exhaust really an upgrade?  (and I 
don't want a simple "yes"... I want DATA!  Who did a before and after dyno runs, 
with NO other changes?)
2) Same for RS2 Exhaust cam... or 7A cam(s)... any REAL data?
3) Before and after results for a tweaked cylinder head...?  No other 
changes?

And the list goes on.

I want hard data that answers these questions... and am willing to spend the 
time/effort/bucks to get them.  For me, this is a hobby I really enjoy... but 
I really lean towards real data to support what I will build.

I'll never forget a BMWCCA dyno day I attended... with my bone stock '72tii.  
There had to be 6-8 other 2002s in attendance... dual webers, shrick cams, 
stahl headers, supersprint exhausts, ported heads, etc... and naturally, huge 
power claims.  There were a lot of bruised egos at the end of that event  ;)  
But an important lesson learned about gathering factual data WRT power mods.
Anyhoooo....
Take care,
Dave