[s-cars] WAS Clear bra info, NOW piano black interior/exterior film?

Wed Oct 1 11:32:10 PDT 2008

It's much easier to replace the passenger side trim if you remove the
glovebox and passenger airbag.  BTDT. 

Regards,

Steven Young
Area Operations Manager - Albany
____________________________________TRANE
301 Old Niskayuna Rd., Latham, NY  12110
Tel: 518.724.1453
Fax: 518.785.4359

www.trane.com

-----Original Message-----
From: s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com
[mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com] On Behalf Of Jack Walker
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 1:48 PM
To: 'Tom Green'; s-car-list at audifans.com
Subject: Re: [s-cars] WAS Clear bra info,NOW piano black
interior/exterior film?

I saw the piano black dash trim somewhere as well, lost the contact, but
did look VERY nice!

Those pieces were removed from the car, and I'm going to wager they were
ground or sanded down then coated with some type of paint or epoxy
finish and then to be replaced on the car. 

I at one time acquired a 93-S4 as a donor for the motor, man I can't
imagine getting the dash pieces off and getting them back on again. I
fought with getting the dash mounted pieces off for like forever! The
passenger side was horrible, I couldn't get my hands in between the
airbag and the frame it mounts to have access to the back of the dash
for the trim attachment...there has to be an easier way!

Any type of film can be applied over the wood finish pieces; I'd just
head off to a sign shop and look at whatever they recommend.

Once again, practice getting it around the corners do some testing on
something that resembles the trim pieces, and as far under the trim as
you can. 

Jack Walker

   _____  

From: Tom Green [mailto:trgreen at comcast.net]
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:44 AM
To: mike claire
Cc: s-car-list; Jack Walker
Subject: Re: [s-cars] WAS Clear bra info, NOW piano black
interior/exterior film?

Jack Walker can probably best answer the question, Mike, but it
shouldn't be a problem to get the material.  Perhaps some personalized
graphics would float your boat.  There would be some 

painstaking work on the corners of the small pieces to achieve a
professional fit, but it would be easily reversible.  You could probably
use black film on a black vehicle exterior too, or graphics to

rival the BMW stuff while protecting the front end.

Tom

On Sep 30, 2008, at 10:57 AM, mike claire wrote:

Sorry for the hijack but it looks like traffic has tapered off on this
thread and I have a related question.

My '91 has wood trim on a black interior and I saw a picture of somebody
who painted it "piano black".  It looked great.

That's too much work for me.  I don't have any experience with these
films we've been discussing here, but I'm wondering if somebody in that
business could cover the wood in place, still in the car.  Self
adhering, heat-shrinking to conform to curves, trim in place with xacto
knife - and piano black (not matte finish)?  Too much to hope for?

On Sun, Sep 21, 2008 at 7:41 PM, Tom Green <HYPERLINK
"mailto:trgreen at comcast.net"trgreen at comcast.net> wrote:

That was the business all right, Jack, and the automobile roll of clear
appeared to be 48" that was fed to the cutter.  Since they did RV's,
aircraft, etc, there were some big patterns to cut.  Perhaps some
graphics would work for the less than perfect paint if we don't run
afoul of the Audi trademark police.

Sorry for the late reply, I've been on vacation for the last two weeks.

The clear bra on my sedan is about 12" up the hood and continues with a
small triangle on the fender frontal area.  The flare has a small strip
up it in 3 pieces through the bumper junction and the bumper and upper
trim is completely covered.  These folks had a lot of experience
designing these kits, installing them, and teaching others how, so I
really think this is the way to make a pre-cut kit.

If you have a fax, I could send you a pattern description for the A6
from their catalog.  I don't have the S6 but this is similar, since the
hood kit would fit exactly, and mirrors and a-pillar trim also.

I agree, the mirror is a great place to experiment on installation.
Perhaps
this newly located company will be the ticket or Kevin can locate the
invinca-
shield stuff.

Tom

> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 22:43:02 -0700
> From: "Jack Walker" <HYPERLINK
"mailto:jack at walkerperformancegroup.com"jack at walkerperformancegroup.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Clear bra info
> To: "'s-car-list'" <HYPERLINK
"mailto:s-car-list at audifans.com"s-car-list at audifans.com>
> Message-ID: <009101c9123e$ed141b40$6402a8c0 at NOTEBOOK>
> Content-Type: text/plain;     charset="windows-1250"
>
> The guys that had the patterns were in the Graphics business, I?ll bet

> it was wide format graphics printing!
>
> I?ve worked in this exact industry for the last 10 years! I at one 
> time researched purchasing the thicker headlight material myself, our 
> vendors wouldn?t sell me partial rolls, and I could buy it from PUMA 
> so I discarded the direction. I?ve never installed the 3M Scotchgard 
> clear, but couldn?t be that much different than the 3M Scotchprint I 
> have installed on vehicles for graphics.
>
>
>
> The Wide Format graphics business starts at 50? output devices and 
> goes easily to 20? (yeah that?s feet) wide rolls. However depending on

> what is necessary for our uses, it might be able to be cut on smaller 
> vinyl plotters like 24?. Depending on the roll widths and what is 
> necessary to cut this particular material with
>
>
>
> I?m assuming you know it ALL comes off a roll, I don?t care if you use

> a CAD or an illustrator file or cut it with a die or a blade!
>
> Professional installers do it with flat pieces to wrap around mirrors 
> door handles, cut to shapes, but they are really good! They cut, heat,

> and stretch it to the absolute limits.
>
>
>
> The material is flat it comes off rolls, there?s no getting around it!
>
> So here?s what ya need to do, go get any flat sticker and wrap it 
> around something smooth like an apple or a water melon.
>
> Practice that, before you consider telling someone they don?t have a 
> chance in hell! Try and cover it with whatever shape or pattern you 
> think will cover either?give it a shot! Better yet get some Goo Gone 
> and practice on your mirrors with some really tacky stickers, I will 
> tomorrow in the daylight!
>
>
>
> So enough of this bantering back and forth!
>
> Sure it is easier for DIY I won?t argue that, if we have patterns,
> so let?s
> make some!
>
> Our panels are big enough and there isn?t any significant issue we
> really
> should have problems with,
>
> I know I can make patterns in any vector based drawing program like
> Illustrator!
>
>
>
> What does everyone want to cover?
>
> Everywhere we stop will create a line that we need to consider when
> polishing and waxing, because the polishes and waxes will adhere to
> the edge
> of the adhesive.
>
> Mirrors? Just the US mirrors, anybody gone to the trouble of gong
> Euro,
> bigger passenger side???
>
> Hood, how far up towards the windshield..6?, 12?, 24?
>
> Front fenders, how far back, cause it could match up to the hood line?
>
> I?ve got chips on the beginning of the flares on my front fenders
>
> Front bumpers, how far back, my vote would be all the way
>
> Then do you want it to wrap around the edges on some pieces and not
> others?
>
> Like if you do go to the back of the bumper sides, why not wrap it
> around
> and tuck in inside of the fender liner?
>
> But where do ya stop on the front/top of the bumper, try and slide
> it under
> the molding, do we do the molding as well?
>
> Same thing on the fender?
>
> Obviously it stops at the top of the hood how ever far back we
> decide, do we
> wrap in under the front!
>
> My vote would be to wrap in under the front.
>
> Go look at some of the professional installs at various
> dealerships, Audis,
> Porsche, MB, BMW, look at how it?s done.
>
> Look at some cars that it?s been on there for a while, check out
> the problem
> areas that it might have bubbled or lifted, why did they happen?
>
> Read the new companies website HYPERLINK
> "HYPERLINK "http://clearfilmprotection.com/"
\nhttp://clearfilmprotection.com/"HYPERLINK
"http://clearfilmprotection.com/" \nhttp://clearfilmprotection.com/
> that is
> doing it now, their notes come from 3M
>
> It is warrantied up to five years, but don?t plan on getting any 3M
> warranty, that only comes from professional installers.
>
>
>
> Headlights are really a no brainer. I cut my own with a razor knife!
>
> You can but the material from PUMA, 800-333-7862.
>
> Mine have been on my S6 Euros for like 2 1/2 years, and the
> previous set I
> cut were on a 91200TQA for like 4 years
>
>
>
> Jack Walker
>
>    _____
>
> From: Tom Green [mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:trgreen at comcast.net"trgreen at comcast.net]
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 9:04 PM
> To: Jack Walker
> Cc: s-car-list; HYPERLINK "mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Clear bra info
>
>
>
> The benefit of having the material pre-cut to the exact pattern
> needed to
> cover the hood and each portion of the front end can not be
> overstated.  If
> it is already pre-cut for a certain area, then you know
>
> that you are not over stretching the film too much or not putting
> it on
> straight.  The film is flat and must be stretched some to fit the
> shape of
> the vehicle.  It's more technique and art than it is rocket
> science, so some
> practice leads to the perfect installation.  If you have the material
> pattern cut to start with, you can do a master installation on the
> first
> try.  If you are starting with roll material, I don't
>
> give you a chance in hell  without a professional installer whom
> you have
> personally watched install raw material on a vehicle.  The sad part
> is, this
> CAD file exists somewhere that makes this a DIY
>
> job.  This thread is all about the money.  A pro can easily provide
> you with
> a high quality job, but you can do it for 1/2 if you have a good kit.
>
>
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> On Sep 8, 2008, at 11:24 PM, Jack Walker wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Guys,
>
> The 3M Scotchgard material is pretty easy to get in many thicknesses,
> exceptionally so! Any large format solvent based inkjet printing
> company can
> get it in the thickness necessary for covering paint on cars, and
> use their
> in house X-Y cutting systems to cut it into the shapes necessary.
> I'm going
> to wager that the material comes in 30", 50" and larger roll
> widths, all
> that's necessary for the shapes is a Freehand, Illustrator or
> vector based
> file to cut them out of the material, not some high end CAD file
> for a die
> cutter. These materials are cut in exactly the same fashion as "cut
> vinyl
> with blade type cutting devices, and some actual lasers in some
> really high
> applications, unless you have so many of one type of vehicles they can
> justify the expense of actually making dies, which aren't cheap!
> This is
> exactly the same cutting formats on stuff I did for many POP
> campaigns for
> large format advertising!
>
> But the material alone isn't the issue as you can see when looking
> at any
> vehicle wrap you might see on the street! The real issue is
> installation;
> it's truly an art form to get the stuff on the cars, convex and
> concave
> shapes and extra material. Although, any competent vehicle graphics
> installer can do it. I'll have to go back into my notes, but 3M has an
> official installer network which could be used with our cut material.
>
> And Tom makes an excellent point, we can make the templates, and
> put it on
> cars! But the stuff looks crappy on anything other than good paint
> jobs!
>
> Jack Walker
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com"s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com"
s-ca
r-list-
> HYPERLINK "mailto:bounces at audifans.com"bounces at audifans.com
> [HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com"s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com"
mail
to:HYPERLINK "mailto:s-car-list-"s-car-list-
> HYPERLINK "mailto:bounces at audifans.c"bounces at audifans.c
> om] On Behalf Of chris chambers
> Sent: Monday, September 08, 2008 2:33 PM
> To: Tom Green; s-car-list; HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK "mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com"HYPERLINK
"mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Clear bra info
>
> Gentz,
>
> The Invinca-Shield.co web site is automaticly forwarded to
> HYPERLINK "HYPERLINK "http://clearfilmprotection.com/"
\nhttp://clearfilmprotection.com/"http://
> HYPERLINK "http://clearfilmprotection.com/" \nclearfilmprotection.com/
>
> I'm gonna guess this new site bought out Invinca-Shield.com
>
>
>
> HTH
> Chris
>
>
>
> --- Tom Green <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:trgreen at comcast.net"trgreen at comcast.net"HYPERLINK
"mailto:trgreen at comcast.net"trgreen at comcast.net>
> wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, Invinca-Shield went out of business last year, Paul.
>>
>> I had called wanting another kit for my avant, but I was told by
>> Kim Handy, the finance director, that they were in negotiations for
>> selling that part of the business as a package, and the company
>> president did not want to jeopardize negotiations.  When things
>> hadn't moved much I offered to buy a number of kits ( 5 to 10 ) in
>> September 2007, but that was nixed as well.  They had a graphics
>> business separate from the clear bra, and I understood they
>> would likely remain in business there, but only sell off the clear
>> bra operation, because it had grown so much, and the installation
>> and dealer installation  training was such a big part of that part of
>>
>> the business.  The president, Bart ? , promised to let me know
>> who bought the patterns (cad-cam software patterns on a H-P
>> computer).  Since nobody is likely to measure another S4 and S6
>> for a kit, I suspect the custom install is the only option now.  $600
>>
>> or so instead of the $260 kit.
>>
>> Then, when I tried to call a month later, the phones were dead and
>> the web site gone.  I have no idea where that hard drive went,
>> but surely someone has it.  It had motorcycle, airplane, motor home,
>>
>> and about any motor vehicle you could imagine in the data-
>> base, all painstakingly measured by hand and transferred to the
>> digital software program via a large x-y plotter.  The pattern
>> cutting was all automated and controlled by the computer just as a
>> CNC milling machine operates.
>>
>> I haven't found any more information about them.  I had hoped some of
>>
>> the installers would know something or a new web site would
>> appear with all their patterns on it.  I am sick about the effort I
>> put in this, only to have this happen.  If you see anything out there
>>
>> that
>> is similar or find anything about this company, please let me know.
>>
>> N. Wilkesboro, NC is such a small town and well off the beaten
>> path that I doubt that any employees that would know the facts
>> remained in the area.
>>
>> I do have an unused kit for a '98 e-class mercedes.  :-)
>>
>> Tom
>>
>>> Date: Mon, 08 Sep 2008 06:00:23 -0400
>>> From: "P. Dooley" <HYPERLINK
>>> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com"HYPERLINK
"mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Clear bra info
>>> To: Floyd Noel <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:floyd.noel at gmail.com"floyd.noel at gmail.com"HYPERLINK
"mailto:floyd.noel at gmail.com"floyd.noel at gmail.com>
>>> Cc: HYPERLINK "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:S-Car-List at audifans.com"S-Car-List at audifans.com"S-Car-
>>> HYPERLINK "mailto:List at audifans.com"List at audifans.com
>>> Message-ID: <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK
"mailto:48C4F7B7.6060406 at icubed.com"48C4F7B7.6060406 at icubed.com"HYPERLIN
K
"mailto:48C4F7B7.6060406 at icubed.com"48C4F7B7.6060406 at icubed.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>>>
>>> That's it Floyd!
>>>
>>> Thanks so much.  I'll be calling them later today.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>>
>>> Floyd Noel wrote:
>>>> HYPERLINK
> "HYPERLINK "http://www.s-cars.org/postnuke/modules.php"
\nhttp://www.s-cars.org/postnuke/modules.php"HYPERLINK
"http://www.s-cars.org/" \nhttp://www.s-cars.org/
> postnuke/m
> odules.php?
>>>>
>> op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=196&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
>>>>
>>>> Is this it?
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Sep 7, 2008 at 7:20 PM, P. Dooley <HYPERLINK
> "mailto:HYPERLINK "mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com"HYPERLINK
"mailto:weski at icubed.com"weski at icubed.com>
>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> So, I remember someone talking about a 3M clear bra kit for the
>>>>> C4 S6
>>>>> cars but I can't find it in the archives.  I thought I saved that
>>
>>>>> post
>>>>> too cause I knew I was going to get some new paint this year and
>>
>>>>> would
>>>>> want the clear bra before winter.  Well, I've got the paint done
>> and
>>>>> aged and know I can't find any place that sells a kit for the 95
>> S6.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone still have the link from the old post?
>>>>>
>>>>> TIA,
>>>>>
>>>>> Paul
>>>>> 95 S6 getting stone chips on a pristine bumper

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