[s-cars] comments appreciated

Wed Aug 29 16:20:06 PDT 2012

Lee,

Your "no two seater"  rule pretty well steers you in the direction you
insist on not going.  If you can accept two seats by going on the cheap
(meaning, take the avant for those few times you need more than two seats,
I'd bet they're rare), then it's Miata or MR2 all the way. Cheap to buy,
cheap to own and cheap to run on the track. Lightweight is all benies, low
drawbacks, especially in Autocross. You'll never be moving fast enough to
know how slow either car is at longer tracks. All of the other "toys" are
going to make you pay to run. My damned Saabaru is now fast enough that
it's been hurting itself (and my wallet). You don't generally see that with
Miatas or MR2s. It would be nice to not find my weekends tied up with
wrenching just to hold the car together between events.  All of the heavy
hitters on the list (including your dreaded Bimmer) won't be able to skip
the wrench as long as the two lightweight 2 seaters.

LL-NY

FWIW, my old A2 GTi was plenty competitive super light, and virtually
maintenance free over 7 successful seasons, and it was also used as an
occasional fun street car and commuter car. The only thing that killed the
car (besides the loss of competitiveness as time goes on) was the damn tree
that a severe storm decided to drop on it.  My point, lightweight, low
power lasts as long as you'll tolerate it =Miata / MR2.
On Wednesday, August 29, 2012, Taka Mizutani wrote:

> Lee-
> I guess you don't want a BMW, huh? :-)
>
> 968s have already hit bottom and are going up- they didn't sell well new
> and thus are getting very hard to find, especially in good condition
> without 150k+ miles. The short belt service interval makes them undesirable
> IME. I think you're far better off with a 986 Boxster, especially since you
> can find a 50-70k miles Boxster S for the same money as a nice 968
> ($15-17k). I won't belabor the IMS issue since you know about it. Also, the
> glass hatch of the 968 is huge $$$ to replace if it is ever broken.
>
> Early 996s are the 3.4L cars, '99-01 for the US market- the '02 is the
> later 3.6L car with the exterior facelift. The interior facelift was in
> '01. Again, you can't buy a nice 3.6L 996 for $20k. What is your ultimate
> budget, how much cargo space do you really need in a "fun" car?
>
> For autox, the NC Miata is your best bet- getting a Touring with the LSD is
> the way to go and you'll have a competitive C Stock car. The Boxster and
> Boxster S (986 chassis) are probably your next best bets, with albeit
> higher running costs. A 996 is not going to be a good choice for autox, nor
> the 968, unless you're talking about Street Prepared (possibly, I'm not
> sure). For track use, any of these cars are fine- just need a rollbar
> extender for the 986.
>
> Are you open to other alternatives? You didn't mention the big giant killer
> of a car- C5 Corvette. Buy one for $15-20k (coupe or FRC, not a Z06), great
> A stock autox car, great track car, low running costs, lots of cargo space,
> lots of power, will smoke a 986 or 996 without a problem. You can't say
> that you're driving a snobby German car, but realistically, no one is going
> to be impressed by a $15-25k Boxster or 996, either. The weaknesses of the
> C5 are very well known and not substantial (some cars have issues with
> EBCM, need upgraded wheel bearings and radiator for heavy track use, need
> brake ducts and hoses for heavy track use, remove the electric column lock
> if it's still there, replace seats for heavy track use). Until you're
> running slicks and aero, you won't need a dry sump unless you're running
> tracks that have very long left handers and you're pushing maximum lateral
> g because you're just *that good*.
>
> Why not a 2-seater? A 996 isn't going to carry anyone in the back besides
> small children.
>
> For all practical purposes, you've outlined an E46 M3, like it or not.
>
> Taka
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 29, 2012 at 2:39 PM, Lee Levitt <lee at wheelman.com<javascript:;>>
> wrote:
>
> > Folks,
> >
> > 5 years ago I asked this group for recommendations on a "play" car --
> > summer driver and autocross/track day car.
> >
> > Pretty much everyone responded with an "M" car recommendation.
> >
> > So I picked up an '01 A4 quattro avant, 1.8t. Had a *lot* of fun with it
> > over the past five years.
> >
> > Looks like my son will be moving out of his '97 A6 and into this '01 A4
> > sometime soon...which leaves me without a summer play car...
> >
> > I'm back for more recommendations, and given my track record, I'm not
> > going to listen again (particularly if the answer is "M" car). :)
> >
> > Here's the question...same criteria as before...still not interested in
> an
> > "M" car. Thinking about a Porsche 968 or perhaps an early 996 C2.
> >
> > 968s are relatively inexpensive to purchase (~$10K) and reasonably
> > competitive in autocross. I believe they've already hit the bottom of
> their
> > depreciation curve. Older car, starting to age slightly, not yet
> difficult
> > to keep on the road...
> >
> > Early (2002) 996s are inexpensive to purchase ($20K+) and also reasonably
> > competitive, in their classes. Newer car, more to break, potentially more
> > expensive when it breaks. I know about the IMS and RMS problems, would
> look
> > for a car with upgraded seals...
> >
> > Again, primary use will be daily driver in the summer. 968 would probably
> > see some increasing (and shared) use as an autocross/track car by several
> > people (me, son, daughter, friend with 997TT, his sons), and eventually
> > replaced as DD by later 996 or 997. If I went the 996 route, we would
> > eventually add a 944 or 968 as shared autocross/track car.
> >
> > Virtually no seat time in either yet, working on that now. I've spent a
> > lot of time on Rennlist, know (intellectually) the basics, but have no
> day
> > to day experience with either of these cars...
> >
> > Boxster would be an obvious, but non-viable alternative...not really
> > interested in pure two seat convertible...Winter car remains '99 A6
> wagon.
> >
> > I know some of you have P-car afflictions in addition to our shared Audi
> > affliction.
> >
> > Comments appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Lee
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