[urq] Turbocharging & Elevations

[QSHIPQ at aol.com]

The problem I have with SAE, is very few engine figrues are as installed, or 
empirical tests as it were.  To truly test BHP we would need to take every 
engine out of the car, and put it on a engine dyno, and double ck that we have 
accounted for things like a grill in front of an IC, lack of venting behind it, 
driveline load, and torsen character (ever watch a torsen hunt on an AWD dyno, 
I have, it's spooky).  SAE 'papers' on the other hand, are a bit 
propagandish, and/or at the very least, special interest.  I have quite a few by audi, and 
there is a lot of flag waving in them.

John, Javad's point holds true, empirically test the best you can.  I'd argue 
that the same dyno with the same car is about as close as it's going to get 
to some sort of 'sae' correction (pun intended).  I say a dyno result depends 
on what you want to do with it. It's a reference unto itself, not necessarily a 
comparison or needs a resultant 'correction'.   Let's not forget, Javad 
shares his results, I applaud him for it, it costs me nothing to see what he's done.

I've been exposed to SAE all my life (my dad used to review and edit 
submissions), I find more humor in your proposition than gospel.   The fact SAE 
doesn't have a whp figure, doesn't surprise me frankly.  Too many variables affect 
that number to use it for more than reference.  But do remember, that all dynos 
are just SAE/physics based calculations done by a machine to make pretty 
graphs and chest thumping brags.  "Serious engineering community"?  I've got a few 
SAE papers in my possession that clearly shows optimism to SAE concept of 
humor and obsurdity.

Best Regards

Scott Justusson

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In a message dated 11/12/2004 8:58:50 AM Central Standard Time, 
johnkoenig at greennet.net writes:
Sorry guys, you missed my point.  I completely understand that horsepower at
the wheels is different than horsepower at the crank or flywheel.  My point
was that "whp" is a bogus unit of measurement.  A quick search of the SAE
website turns up 558 references to "bhp" while a seach for "whp" turns up
exactly zero hits.  To be meaningful it's important to be clear about what
is being measured, and how, but in the serious engineering community "whp"
doesn't mean anything.  Just clarifying ...

And, yeah, I agree, most of the time it's torque that rules!!!

John