[urq] Fw: Intermittent no start, now a weird intermittent start.
Keith
spotatashleys at hotmail.com
Sat Jun 29 14:14:14 PDT 2013
Evening All
An update on the intermittent start saga. It’s rather looking like a combination of things that contributed to the end result. After checking all the connections and cleaning them all up again to a nice shiny finish it made little difference. It just seemed that the battery, all though fairly new was not just man enough for the job. Even when apparently fully charged it only ever showed 12.3 volts. So I did some research and discovered that there were several batteries fitted to the Quattro from 58Ah to 72Ah and with somewhere between 480A and 620A cold cranking power. I also found a Bosch technical note on some website that said never fit a battery on a car which is showing less than 12.6v. So I went and bought a Bosch Silver S3 096 rated at 72Ah which seems to be the biggest and best that will fit in the battery well and things started to look up. This showed 12.7v straight off the shelf and turned it over like a dream. No stutters, no incidences of silence after turning the key. Now it just didn’t want to start cleanly.
I started to doubt myself now. New starter and new battery, clean leads, plenty of volts, plenty of amps just no fire. So I went back to basics. Whipped out the plugs, turned it by hand to TDC at the crank. Now I know this is spot on because when I built the engine I added my own TDC timing mark set using a dial gauge (incidentally the factory timing mark on the flywheel is not an accurate TDC it is approximate, a degree or so out). I check TDC on the cam pulley and the distributor and all were still spot on. Plugs were new. Anyway to cut an already long story short, I managed to get it to start, ran it up the road to get to normal temperature and then using the air/fuel meter as a guide I checked the mixture and found it to be rich and so wound it back a bit.
I am fairly confident that the old starter was performing poorly (brushes worn out) and the battery was not putting out sufficient power (it was already the lowest spec fitted to the Quattro) and with a dodgy mixture too, it really was a struggle. Why was the mixture wrong? No idea but I have just had the head off to replace the gasket so perhaps there had been a minor air leak which the rebuild has fixed making it run rich?
Anyway, thanks to all of you who provided advice, suggestions and good wishes. I really appreciate it.
I cured the fuel smell too but I’ll put that in a separate posting.
Regards
Keith
‘87 WR (in sunny Worcestershire)
-----Original message-----
From: Keith <spotatashleys at hotmail.com>
To: urq at audifans.com
Sent: Wed, Jun 19, 2013 14:43:32 EDT
Subject: Re: [urq] Intermittent no start, now a weird intermittent start.
I've now re-checked the connections at the battery and the solenoid and I
have removed and cleaned up the connections at the alternator but to be
honest they were shiny clean anyway. Put it back together and tried again.
Started first time. But struggled a second time. Third time wouldn't start.
Just turned over in a very laboured way. It doesn't spin-up like I think it
should even when it starts.
The battery is not very old at all. Perhaps 18 months, but the car has been
inactive for a good part of that (off road due to head gasket blown and lazy
owner). Could it be that although it shows a respectable voltage, the
battery just can't put out the power because of something caused by it not
having been used for a long time and perhaps the lack of oomph was a
contributary cause to my original intermittent non-start?
I'm at a loss really. I guess I need to either buy a new battery or at least
get this one tested for power output to rule that theory out.
Regards
Keith
'87 WR
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 6:56 PM
To: urq at audifans.com
Subject: Re: [urq] Intermittent no start, now a weird intermittent start.
Latest update - before I start removing wires and cleaning up
terminals/connectors.
The connections to the battery are good, clean and secure.
The connections to the alternator and starter are good and secure but yet to
be determined if they are clean.
The solenoid has a heat wrap on it (from my old starter) and my exhaust is
wrapped in heat proof bandage and I haven't been on long trips so I don't
think heat soak is an issue.
I put the meter on the battery - 12.33v With the ignition on, this drops to
around 12v. When I start the car (it started first time!) the voltage
momentarily dropped but once running and stable the meter showed steady
12.6v.
Going to have a look at the alternator end of the leads and see if these
need cleaning up. In doing the head gasket job the only wiring I have
disturbed (to do with starting) are the earth wires to the cam cover, the
starter wires, the battery terminal connections and that's it. Are there any
other main earth leads from the block? Those two wires to the cam cover
don't seem enough.
Will update when I know more but any further suggestions welcomed in the
meantime.
Cheers
Keith
'87 WR
-----Original Message-----
From: Keith
Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2013 5:19 PM
To: urq at audifans.com
Subject: [urq] Intermittent no start, now a weird intermittent start.
Sometime ago I put up a series of posts about an intermittent no start where
it sometimes would start fine and sometimes I’d turn the key and nothing
would happen, not even a click. However if I rocked the car a bit whilst in
gear, it would start. Not only was this a pain when it happened it was a bit
embarrassing too. I put up with it for far too long.....because it was
intermittent.
Anyway after getting it all back together and up and running following the
head gasket job I resolved to purchase and fit a new starter motor which I
did today. (had a day off work quattro day in the sunshine!).
Now the new starter turns every time and whirrs nicely like a starter on a
modern new car but..........after initially starting reasonably well the
next time it turns slowly like the battery is run down and doesn’t fire. So
I charge the battery up which surprisingly didn’t take long so it couldn’t
have been too low. This time it fired up. I went for a short drive, came
back, switched off. 5 Minutes later tried to start it and it turns over
slowly like low battery but won’t start. Battery showing 12.33v and when I
put it on the charger it shows fully charged. I am not great at diagnosing
electrical faults. Fine at repairing them but not good at identifying them.
Anyone have any ideas what’s going on. Sorry to be monopolising the list at
the moment but having a beautiful car and wonderful weather.....yes that’s
right wonderful weather in England...I’m really disappointed not to be able
to be out enjoying it on the open road. So if you have any ideas, as usual,
I will be most grateful. Many thanks.
All the best
Keith
‘87 WR
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