[V8] Hot cams

[Mike Arman]

> 
> Mike, the deal I'm talking bout goes like this.
> Tom (guy in germany) has 4.2l cams for $165US..so no
> need to send cams to Hans & Fritz in the Fatherland.
> The cams for the 4 are $800 + the $165 (cam core) $965
> + sea shipping $50..or add $41 for air freight $91.
> So taotal is $1,056 total.

Ron,

I'm not sure I'm following this . . . what I think I'm seeing is Tom in 
Germany has a set of cams (all four) for $165, it costs $800 to 
re-profile them, and then $41 or $91 to ship them here. (Did I get that 
right?)

Does he have more than one set at this price? (I get the impression he 
does.)

> 
>  So you'r talking bout $932 before anybody ships there
> cams to Florida..& then back to the owner(s). So
> prices compair to those you have.


Not 'sactly. If Crane regrinds your cams, there's no core (no $165) and 
the cost is $432 plus freight to and from Florida - so we're talking $500.

Remember the guy from Crane said we only *might* need buckets - if there 
are no buckets needed, the price to regrind "your" cams is $432 plus 
domestic UPS or Fedex.


If we DO need buckets, then it becomes a grand - and the guy in Germany 
doesn't mention needing them or not - if we don't need them for him, we 
shouldn't need them for Crane either. If Tom's cams need buckets, then 
the Germany price goes to $1,500 for the cams and buckets, if he doesn't 
need them and Crane's cams do, the price is comparable. If we don't need 
them with either set, Crane beats the Fatherland by $500 and some time.



Now - I've looked in Family Album for part numbers, here's what I found:

Exhaust cams are the same PN for all 3.6 and 4.2, standard shift or 
automatic. That tells me even if the head castings are not the same 
(didn't the bore spacing change slightly?), the cam bearing areas are - 
at least for the exhausts.

PT engines open 30.5 degrees BBDC, close 2 degrees BTDC
ABH engines open 31 degrees BBDC, close 2 degrees BTDC

Note the specs are different, even though the part number is the same! I 
guess half a degree doesn't bother them.


Intake cams are different between 3.6 and 4.2, and between std and auto, 
four different part numbers.

PT engines open 11 deg ATDC, ABH opens 7 degrees ATDC
PT engines close 28.5 deg ABDC, ABH closes 29 deg ABDC

Note the intake cam part numbers are different for standard or 
automatic, but the timing isn't! The timing changes between PT and ABH, 
but not within each engine type for standard or automatic. (Yes, it is 
confusing.)

Again, not a big difference, just four degrees on the opening timing 
(but that does make more of a difference than half a degree.)

Note that I do NOT have the valve lift figures on any of these cams! 
That may be the difference, I don't know yet.





> & the guy I talked to said nothing bout replacement
> buckets..& Mark W who has Scott J's spec2 cams said
> anything bout replacing the buckets.

Then it is possible the buckets don't have to be changed with moderate 
increases in lift. Recall the extra lift is found by grinding the base 
circle of the cam, so the cam followers now have to go higher up to 
contact the cam - I wonder how much leeway there is here? Can we add 
.100" without problems? How about .250" (that I doubt)?


> 
>  There are a bunch of other things that need to be
> taken into consideration.

True, true, true.

  But I'm still finding out
> the specs on a more agressive grind than the 260/264.
>  3 of the cams are billit(sp?)

Should be all four . . . why should one intake or exhaust not be billet 
and the other one is?

  & there needs to be the
> same lobe seperation..or as close to stock as
> possible..but as I said there are a few things that
> need to be ironed out.

Lets try to iron them out - I'm not looking to knock your guy in any 
way, I'm just trying to find the most cost effective way for us V8 
owners to do this and blow off the mommyvans. If the same work can be 
done here, it *has* to be cheaper and faster than sending parts overseas.

When I get the lift figures and some more information, I'll be calling 
Crane back.

Damn, and I just changed the timing belt . . . and its gotta come off 
again to swap the cams. RATS!

Best,

Mike