[V8] Gut check....what's it worth

[Roger Woodbury]

-----Original Message-----
 I was pondering this yesterday as I was experiencing some quirks with my
transmission driving along.  If we drop a transmission in either one of our
Audis I will have a real hard time thinking about either fixing the car or
just replacing it. 

The simple truth is V8's are worth very, very little, and only the most
perfect of perfect cars with very low miles are worth anything at all.  That
is the simple blunt truth.  There are very few V8's around with fewer than
100,000 miles and one of those, IF perfect will probably not fetch more than
four or five thousand bucks on the market.  

That your car is a factory five speed means absolutely zero now.  Oh, I can
hear the screams of rage and protest but the truth is that a factory five
speed Audi V8 is worth only what it is worth to some one who wants a factory
Audi V8 five speed, OR wants the transmission to yank out for something
else.  And the truth is that a nearly more than fifteen years old for the
newest V8 Quattro, there will be very, very few people even interested in
owning such an old and complicated cars.  

The insurance company does not use the Kelly Blue Book that you and I can
buy in the book store, or review on line. The insurance industry has a lot
of industry wide data that is published for industry use only, just as banks
have their own method of establishing value for loan purposes.  In almost
all cases the value of the used car is vastly less than KBB's optimistic
retail valuations.  

When I was in the insurance agency business the two lines of insurance that
I liked the least were homeowners and personal auto insurance.  As far as
personal auto insurance is concerned, there is never a way that people are
really satisfied with the results of a loss, especially if they have expect
the car to be "fully covered".  It never is.

But because your car is an "old" Audi with five speed, you have a glimmer of
hope, and I will suggest that you carefully consider what you want to do,
what you are willing to do, and what is in the best interest of you and your
family as you think about the V8's future.

I don't know how many miles you have on the car but I'm going to guess it is
nearly 150K.  I watch the prices of these cars as best I can since
eventually I may buy a second car for parts alone, but my best guess is that
in the real world, IF your car was whole and without significant damage the
best you would get for it is not more than $4000.  I think that is ALL the
money, and it wouldn't surprise me if after six months of trying the best
offer you could get would be something below $3000.

Your car has some serious front end sheet metal work that it needs. I assume
that the car is not driveable and needing headlight and hood it won't pass
any inspection probably.  If that is the case then the car is worth $500.  

IF someone didn't have to haul it far, and it ran fine other than needing
the sheetmetal, it might bring a grand.  Frankly I doubt it because there
are intact V8's around that are never going to be roadworthy but the basic
pieces are there that make them desirable as parts.

I also believe that the longer you wait to get rid of it hoping for more
money, the less the car will bring simply because the enthusiast pool for
these cars is dropping faster than the supply of low mileage cars.  I like
driving my 20 year old V8 and especially because I know that I won't see
another one just like it on the road, and if I do, it is cause for
celebration.  There aren't a lot of us around.

So, what the insurance adjuster will do is look at the car as so many old
Audi parts. The car to the insurance company is something that will be
wholesaled out to one of its group of pet recyclers and they already know
that they will get a few hundred dollars for it best case.  They might offer
you $2500 for the car as it is, and they might sell it back to you for a
little less than that.  For an insurance company total loss settlement these
are pretty small dollars.  It will also make a bit of difference whether
they use an employee appraiser or an adjuster who is an independent
contractor who is hired as an appraiser.  This will not be an adjusted loss,
but an appraisal of the total loss of the car.  They will not negotiate a
whole lot either.  They know that the car is of limited value in the market.

Strategies?  There are some.

First, go to the nearest Audi dealer and ask the sales manager what they
would ask for the car BEST CASE at retail, assuming the car is intact, in
excellent mechanical and cosmetic condition.  Ask the dealer if they will
give you a simple statement on their letter head stating that value, IF they
had the car sitting on their lot. Tell them that you need this documentation
for an insurance settlement.  They will probably give you a valuation that
is at least what KBB will show in the book at the bookstore.  The key is to
get it in writing:  make sure that you explain that it is not an appraisal
of YOUR car, but of the value of your car if you had it on their lot in the
condition that you describe.  

Do this with three other dealers...used car dealers are fine. The object of
the game is to get at least three written statements that your '91 Audi V8
FIVE SPEED, in good condition on my lot for delivery to a retail customer is
worth "X" dollars.  

What you will have done is establish the ACTUAL CASH VALUE of your '91 Audi
in your zip code (VERY important).  This will be very important if you
negotiate a settlement value with an insurance appraiser/adjuster.

You will need a body shop estimate of the cost to repair the damage to the
front end.  If you have ONE estimate in writing, then you can take the
dealers' estimates that you have and subtract the body work estimate and
that will be the BEST CASE that you can expect to get for the car if you
surrender title to the insurance company.  

My guess is that the magic number will not exceed $2500.00.  The insurance
company will probably NOT authorize repair but will want to total the car
out for $1500 worth of damage.  IF they do decide to pay to repair the
damage, then that brings us to the option of keeping the car, fixed, as a
driver, OR perhaps trying to sell it later as an intact, running example.

Assuming that the car is mechanically without significant needs, and all
that really needs to be done is to fix fender, nose and hood for $1500, if
the car can be repaired and driven and you have interest in continuing to
have it available to you as a driver, then it is worth whatever it takes to
keep it. There will likely not be another car like it in your lifetime for
anywhere near the cost of keeping it.  I like my own car and if I couldn't
have it any more for whatever reason, I would likely not want anything else
like it at all.  

If all it takes is $1500 to make your car a whole driver for what you will
have even if you have NO insurance money, its pretty cheap.  

Yeah, it won't pull a horse trailer.  And it's a pretty small car to carry
two adults and three children in, especially for a long trip.  It's a nice
roomy car for two adults and luggage, and a fair car for four adults and
luggage.  But it really won't pull horses.  If that is a prime
consideration, then you may have to "pony" up (I couldn't resist that!) for
a 1Ton dually diesel.

If you don't have decent storage space for the car, then that is another
consideration.  Having another car lying about, one that isn't driven every
day, or is expensive to repair and is seldom driven makes very little sense.
V8's are lovely cars when working well, but are never going to be
appreciating value cars like Ferraris.

It all comes down to what the car is worth to you.  If you can afford to
keep it and use it for chuckles and grins, then getting the cost of fixing
it out of the insurance company is a great way to make the car whole as a
driver.  

If you sell it as is, you won't get a whole lot, and if you try to sell it
fixed you won't get a huge amount either.  But once it is fixed and whole
and running well, you won't get another car as satisfying to drive and enjoy
unless s you pay a whole lot more.

I think at the end of the day it isn't at all about what these cars are
worth in cash on the market. It is only about what they are worth as an
automobile to you as the current owner.  But be forearmed before you deal
with the insurance company.  I doubt that you will win much, but prepared
you won't lose either.

I'll look forward to reading how this all turns out.

Roger