[V8] gearbox swap questions

Mon May 27 11:04:36 PDT 2013

It's apparent you know very little about the subject so I'll end the
conversation with a Happy memorial day!

Scott

On Mon, May 27, 2013 10:55 am, Professor GT gmail wrote:
> Scott,
>
> With all due respect, an additional gear (6-speed) does not "make" more
> horsepower, as an engine makes what it makes, and that's it. At a given
> speed the dyno may show a higher power level because a different gear
> ratio has the engine closer to its peak output level over a broader range.
> The only way however that a transmission can "enhance" an engines' power
> is with the use of a torque converter, which again, a manual trans does
> not have. Torque multiplication ratios range typically from 1.5:1 to as
> high as 3.0:1, so an automatic can almost triple an engine's
> launch/acceleration torque (vortex flow mode). A manual transmissions'
> clutch - no such luck.  Torque converters also add a lockup clutch, so the
> remaining 2% of hydraulic loss (inefficiency) in the rotary mode of
> operation is effectively eliminated.
>
> The whole idea of efficiency (and more gears) is to keep the engine in its
> peak output power band as much as possible, which computer controlled
> automatics do better than any human could manually hope to accomplish.
> This is the whole idea behind today's 8/9 speed automatics and CVTs.
> Again, employed through the use of computer controls as speed & accuracy
> (among other things) are the main reasons computer controls prevail.
>
> Just for a moment imagine driving a 9 speed stick. NOT! Not only would the
> driver be doing nothing but shifting constantly, but consider selecting
> the proper ratio under varying conditions AND doing so at the same level
> of speed and accuracy as can be done via computer controls, and one can
> begin to understand the issue.
>
> I'm not trying to condemn manual transmissions, just trying to educate
> folks on the realities of current technology, so they can choose wisely.
>
> Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, but what we can't see may put us at
> a disadvantage. Opening our eyes to ALL the options with a clear
> understanding of the advantages and disadvantages  of each, allows us to
> make wise choices. I hope I've been able to shed a bit more unbiased light
> on the subject.
>
> Remember, I'm driving my V8 stick, but in no way purport to support that
> it is superior in any way to an automatic. It is just a choice I have
> made, mostly for the fun factor associated with it. Now, if I could build
> a control unit that would allow me to add paddle-shifting capability to a
> 4HP24 THAT would really be the trick.
>
> Just sayin' LOL!
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> ProfessorGT
> (Sent from my iPhone4)
>
> On May 25, 2013, at 4:54 PM, "Scott DeWitt"
> <scotty at advancedautomotion.com> wrote:
>
>> In the C5 a 6 speed conversion will yield approx 20-25hp additional on
>> the
>> dyno and 2-3 mpg on gas 6 speed ratios and 5-8mpg using diesel trans
>> ratios.
>>
>> Automatic are becoming commonplace in most new cars not because they are
>> more efficient than a manual but rather people are lazy and
>> manufacturers
>> have much more control over engine operation, emissions, and warranty
>> issues if a computer is shifting gears versus the driver.
>>
>> There is a stand alone controller for ZF boxes but to be honest if the
>> OP
>> runs the numbers he will never recoup the money spent with fuel savings.
>> The 3.6 V8 in a 4000+ pound car is not intended and never was to be king
>> in fuel efficiency.
>>
>> On Fri, May 24, 2013 10:56 pm, Professor GT gmail wrote:
>>> Oh boy, here we go!
>>>
>>> First off, ALL manufacturers these days are using communication links
>>> like
>>> CAN BUS, to tie EVERYTHING together. The VW Phaeton (a real fart in
>>> church) had something like 60 control units all talking to each other
>>> over
>>> CAN.
>>> There are many benefits, and I can go on for quite some time about this
>>> (my J1939 datalink presentation is over 140 slides), but the drawbacks
>>> are
>>> mainly centered around Servicability issues.
>>>
>>> So, the point, forgetting about any possible hardware issues, is the
>>> lack
>>> of flexibility with respect to vehicle integration, or installing and
>>> then
>>> properly controlling that trans in a vehicle it was not designed for.
>>> That
>>> said, anything is possible, but practicality has to enter into the
>>> equation also. Bottom line, not worth it!
>>>
>>> Secondly, on the automatic versus stick debate: there is NO compelling
>>> reason to switch from an auto to a manual Trans, other than if you
>>> enjoy
>>> playing with a clutch pedal and a shifter, PERIOD!
>>>
>>> Better fuel economy with a manual?
>>> NOT!
>>> Maybe years ago, but with today's electronic controls, automatics are
>>> far
>>> superior.
>>>
>>> Vehicle Control? See previous response!
>>>
>>> Pulling power? That thing called a torque converter kicks a clutches
>>> ass
>>> hands down every time! See previous response!
>>>
>>> Driver Comfort, and ease of operation?
>>> Do I even need to ask?
>>>
>>> And with all this in mind, when applied to larger vehicles the case is
>>> even more compelling for automatics! Any trucker who buys a new vehicle
>>> with a stick is just kidding himself! The ONLY reason a trucker would
>>> prefer a stick is because of the Neanderthal effect. It has been proven
>>> over and over, beyond a shadow of a doubt that an Allison automatic is
>>> far
>>> superior to any manual or automated manual ever created.
>>>
>>> Okay, now that I got that off my chest and put those facts out there,
>>> before you call me a hypocrite, let me say that I have my V8 5-speed
>>> for
>>> the novelty and rarity factors, coupled with the fact that its just fun
>>> to
>>> drive! That is at least until I hit traffic!
>>> Having an original factory V8 5-speed is cool, and to the automotive
>>> purist represents the best that the Europeans had to offer in its
>>> class,
>>> at the time.
>>> I spite of the traffic I have not grown tired of it, and view it as a
>>> blessing for the long weekend commutes I've been doing since last
>>> Fall...........but an automatic is in the wings to replace my 5-speed
>>> as a
>>> daily driver so I can save the stick for special occasions!
>>>
>>> Now I feel much better that my rant is done! LOL
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> ProfessorGT
>>> (Sent from my iPhone4)
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>>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks!
>> Scott DeWitt
>> Advanced Automotion
>> Ph:  720.4.GEARS.1 (720.443.2771)
>> Fax: 361.288.8030
>> Any price quoted in this email is valid for 15 days, and subject to
>> availability.
>> Http://www.advancedautomotion.com
>> Shipping, Return, and Warranty policies
>> http://www.advancedautomotion.com/shipping.php
>> http://www.advancedautomotion.com/warranty.php
>>
>

-- 
Thanks!
Scott DeWitt
Advanced Automotion
Ph:  720.4.GEARS.1 (720.443.2771)
Fax: 361.288.8030
Any price quoted in this email is valid for 15 days, and subject to
availability.
Http://www.advancedautomotion.com
Shipping, Return, and Warranty policies
http://www.advancedautomotion.com/shipping.php
http://www.advancedautomotion.com/warranty.php