[Vwdiesel] something worth trading the A4 in for

[David Schwarze]

What you say below is simply not true.  Horsepower DOES move things. 
More HP will get you down the road more quickly, regardless of torque.

The units of HP and Torque tell the story.  Power (hp) is a quantity 
that you can use along with the weight of the vehicle, friction, 
aerodynamic drag, etc. to predict how quickly a car will accelerate.  It 
is a measure of how much work is being done.  Accelerating a car is work.

Torque is a measurement of rotational force which CANNOT be used to 
predict how quickly a car will accelerate (why not, you say?  Because 
"it depends" on the RPM).

For a real world example, take a sport bike.  That fits your definition 
of "massive amounts of hp and little to no torque".  Ever race one of 
those at a stoplight in your diesel VW?  I'm sure with the massive 
torque of the diesel engine that poor sport bike didn't stand a chance, 
right?


Terry Briggs wrote:
> You can have massive amounts of HP and little to no torque, and said 
> car, plane {insert fav mode of transport} and you won't go anywhere 
> fast but once you get it rolling, will be able to get some good speed.  
> HP doesn't move anything, torque is what gets the world moving. Torque 
> being a rotational force applied. if it doesn't have the grunt to twist 
> the axle, not going to move much. Granted there is a hand in hand 
> correlation between HP and torque, but it is possible to have hi torque 
> and low hp and beat anything that pulls up next to you, you just need 
> the right weight car, bike etc. Compared to a gasser, a diesel truck 
> has low hp and very hi torque, off the line the gasser doesn't stand a 
> chance, massive amounts of torque to get the load rolling, down the 
> line, due to several factors like rpm capability of a gasser compared 
> to a diesel things change but there are still more examples of diesels 
> smoking the tires off of a gasser due to torque.
> On Jul 6, 2008, at 3:07 AM, David Schwarze wrote:
> 
> 
>>Sorry, but HP is what moves the car.  Period.  Torque does you no good
>>if you don't have some RPM to go with it, and at that point you are
>>talking about HP (because HP is basically torque X RPM).
>>
>>Torque is only useful as a measurement of the specific output of the
>>engine at a particular RPM.  Good for measuring efficiency, not
>>particularly useful in determining how fast a car will accelerate.
>>
>>The more HP you have, the faster the car will accelerate.  Rapid
>>acceleration is a simple matter of commanding the motor to the RPM 
>>which
>>provides maximum HP and keeping it as close to that RPM as possible.
>>Notice that I did not mention torque anywhere in that sentence.
>>
>>The advantage of a diesel is that it makes relatively high HP at low
>>RPMs... so at low RPM you have an advantage with the diesel.  Great for
>>towing.  At high RPM however the diesel loses it's advantage and high
>>RPM is where the most horsepower is made.
>>
>>Consider two cars - one making 60lb/ft peak torque and 100 peak hp and
>>the other making 100 lb/ft peak torque and 60 peak hp (with typical
>>torque curves).  Which do you think will win a drag race?  I will bet
>>every dime on the car making 100hp, and you should too, unless you want
>>to lose your money.
>>
>>-David
>>
>>lbaird119 at aol.com wrote:
>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: Terry Briggs <vbriggs at stny.rr.com>
>>>To: Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
>>>Sent: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 9:36 pm
>>>Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] something worth trading the A4 in for
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>to use an old racers saying, HP doesn't win races, torque wins races.
>>>Torque gets you moving, hp allows you to maintain speed once the 
>>>torque
>>>drops off. The curve of which determines how fast the end result is.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>GLAD to hear someone else say something like that!
>>>
>>>I've said for years that HP is what you brag about,
>>>
>>>torque is what turns the wheels.  :-)  It's SO hard
>>>
>>>to convince someone that a smaller hp diesel CAN
>>>outperform a larger HP gasser because it has MORE
>>>
>>>torque!
>>>     Loren
>>>
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>>>Vwdiesel mailing list
>>>Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
>>>http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>>>
>>
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>>
> 
> M.I. 6
> Custom Design and Fabrication
> 2576 King Circle
> Corning, New York 14830
> Vbriggs at stny.rr.com
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