[Vwdiesel] Age, Diesel History and BONUS TDI Tragedy
Bill Kelly
magnificationbill at hotmail.com
Tue Dec 8 18:57:55 PST 2009
I just turned 50. Have been lurking and learning here for several years.Been driving VW/Audi diesels since 1981, when my first company car was an LS Rabbit diesel. That started it.
Then there were Jettas, Golfs, Audi 5000TD's, a ( trouble free !) Buick 6.2 diesel Estate Wagon, and a Blazer K5 6.2. Spent most of the 90's traveling GA and TN in a black 92 ECO which most definately enjoyed being revved, with care. In '03, I sold it to a retiring Marine, who bought it sight unseen, and drove it the next day from Georgia to Las Vegas to his new job with the EPA. Next: An '01 Jetta GLS/TDI, which served me well for 280,000 miles, right up to last Friday- when it suddenly expired a few hundred feet uphill from Dwight Harrison VW on HWY 78. I've always replaced tbelts/tensioners/wpumps, synth oil/filter change at 10k intervals, and my little buddy ran like a champ with no sign of distress right up until the last revolution. I had pulled away from a light, and had just put the clutch in to shift, when it died, with a faint,quick sound of metal to metal...I kept the clutch in, coasted up to the dealer's service entrance and told my Service Advisor friend what happened. They pushed it back right away and it was pronounced dead on the scene. The tbelt/tensioner had been replaced last month ( by dealer ) , and looked fine. Injector pump is fine. The engine won't turn- seized solid... Dealer pricing for a rebuild ( discounted ! )? 6,000.00 . I'm having it towed to my garage tomorrow where it will lie in state until I can figure out what to do. It's Reflex Silver w/ black leather, 5 speed. It's time for new Michelins and control arm bushings, otherwise it's in fine shape. I am fortunately blessed with a Volvo 740/5.0 V8 wagon as a backup, but my fuel cost has just doubled ( 20mpg v. 40 mpg ).
Does anyone have any advice re: What happened !? Where to get a used engine in Georgia ? Sniff....I think I have something in my eye....
Many thanks,
Bill Kelly
01 Jetta TDI/ RIP
96 Volvo 850 wagon
89 Volvo 745 Turbo converted to Ford 5.0/HO/AOD
> From: vwdiesel-request at vwfans.com
> Subject: Vwdiesel Digest, Vol 74, Issue 23
> To: vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 18:21:38 -0800
>
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (mark shepherd)
> 2. Re: Grumpy starting (Erik Lane)
> 3. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (Tad)
> 4. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (doonboggle)
> 5. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (mark shepherd)
> 6. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (mark shepherd)
> 7. Re: Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup (Tad)
> 8. Window regulator (mikitka)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 00:20:33 -0000
> From: "mark shepherd" <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: "vw fans" <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>, "doonboggle"
> <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> Message-ID: <AFC0472F20EF4B7885FF8EB5F69C6685 at mark>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Could be that you've wasted money, as it may be your ignition switch giving
> out, and not a starter issue at all... :o(
>
> Mark
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "doonboggle" <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:13 AM
> Subject: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
>
>
>
> Recently joined after puirchasing a 1981 rabbit diesel pickup with 1.6L
> engine. I am no longer 'my mechanic' due to having some disks in my spine
> bolted-screwed together a few years ago, and not as nimble as I used to be.
>
> So took it to a local 'vw expert', who turned out to not be so expert ...
> when it comes to diesels ... only air cooled it seems.
>
> One of the things he advised right away was that the starter (apparently
> original) was 'shot'. So I went looking, and found a fellow who said he had
> one for that year that he bought a few years ago, had never used, and that
> it was "rebuilt". So bought it.
>
> Took to the expert, and today, after doing a valve job, and supposedly
> retiming the injector pump (my command), he called and said the rebuilt one
> was 'shot' also. He took me to the truck on his floor, and turned the key.
> Immediately it started, which seemed to surprise him. So he turned it off,
> and sure enough, it took about 3-4-5 more key 'on' before it engaged ...
> with just a clunk in the background.
>
> So am wondering ... could this rebuilt starter be for a gas rather than
> diesel? Does it make a difference? Dummie me never considered this. To me,
> starter is starter.
>
> If no difference, what could it possibly be? I have no reason to disbelieve
> the fellow who sold it to me, and it did in fact come in the original
> shipping box that indicated rebuilt.
>
> Oh, by the way, the battery is new. Only odd thing is that last night, the
> temperature got down to 10 degrees below in our little podunk town, but when
> I was there for his exibition, it was mid day, and the interior was not that
> cold.
>
> Open for suggestions.
> Thanks
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Vwdiesel mailing list
> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 16:19:43 -0800
> From: Erik Lane <eriklane at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Grumpy starting
> To: William J Toensing <toensing at wildblue.net>
> Cc: vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> Message-ID:
> <fbb9452c0912081619n34624283mfa8e2df571f00fbf at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> There's some conflicting info out there.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_plug
> http://www.yourautonetwork.com/freeze_plug.html
>
> Basically it looks like the plugs on the side of an engine block really are
> for freeze protection, but that others are not?
>
> I went looking to see how a TDI would be able to have a block without
> casting holes, if others need them. But if it really is for freeze
> protection when the holes are on the sides of the block then that would mean
> that they aren't as worried about it freezing. Well, to put it better they
> aren't as convinced that the freeze plug holes would help.
>
> But I don't know much at all about casting. And those pages seemed to
> contradict themselves by saying that most plugs weren't for freeze
> protection, except for those on the side of the engine, which seems to be
> the majority of them, in my experience. So I'm not sure how much to believe
> what they say.
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 4:19 PM, William J Toensing <toensing at wildblue.net>wrote:
>
> > I wouldn't waste time putting a heating pad under a battery. Instead, put a
> > battery charger or trickle charger on the battery. This way the battery
> > temperature is raised to around +70F &battery will be fully charged. Haven't
> > owned a TDI although I would like to. If there are no accessible frost
> > plugs, why not splice the lower radiator hose & install one there? Some of
> > the Canadian & Alaska members should be able to find out what sort of engine
> > heaters they use on TDIs.
> > As to frost plugs, they are really there to clean the sand out of the block
> > after it was cast, not as a protection against freezing. One pet peeve I
> > have is that manufacturers use steel rather than brass. The steel will rust
> > out but the brass plugs won't. Steel is used because it is cheaper. False
> > economy, in my opinion. Had one of those front plugs rust out on my wife's
> > Taurus. The plug was located in the behind the bell housing so the
> > transmission has to be removed. Was over my head & expensive to have a
> > professional remove it. Told him to remove every steel OEM frost plug &
> > replace them with brass or bronze frost plugs.
> > Bill Toensing, Nevada City, CA
> > _______________________________________________
> > Vwdiesel mailing list
> > Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 16:30:42 -0800
> From: Tad <tadc at europa.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: mark shepherd <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>
> Cc: vw fans <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>, doonboggle <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> Message-ID:
> <47fd54fd0912081630w3bbae263qa26d5b5393861b29 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> The 'clunk' would be the solenoid, so that would imply that the key circuit
> is working.
>
> Check the part number on the starter.
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 4:20 PM, mark shepherd <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>wrote:
>
> > Could be that you've wasted money, as it may be your ignition switch giving
> > out, and not a starter issue at all... :o(
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "doonboggle" <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> > To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> > Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:13 AM
> > Subject: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> >
> >
> >
> > Recently joined after puirchasing a 1981 rabbit diesel pickup with 1.6L
> > engine. I am no longer 'my mechanic' due to having some disks in my spine
> > bolted-screwed together a few years ago, and not as nimble as I used to be.
> >
> > So took it to a local 'vw expert', who turned out to not be so expert ...
> > when it comes to diesels ... only air cooled it seems.
> >
> > One of the things he advised right away was that the starter (apparently
> > original) was 'shot'. So I went looking, and found a fellow who said he had
> > one for that year that he bought a few years ago, had never used, and that
> > it was "rebuilt". So bought it.
> >
> > Took to the expert, and today, after doing a valve job, and supposedly
> > retiming the injector pump (my command), he called and said the rebuilt one
> > was 'shot' also. He took me to the truck on his floor, and turned the key.
> > Immediately it started, which seemed to surprise him. So he turned it off,
> > and sure enough, it took about 3-4-5 more key 'on' before it engaged ...
> > with just a clunk in the background.
> >
> > So am wondering ... could this rebuilt starter be for a gas rather than
> > diesel? Does it make a difference? Dummie me never considered this. To me,
> > starter is starter.
> >
> > If no difference, what could it possibly be? I have no reason to disbelieve
> > the fellow who sold it to me, and it did in fact come in the original
> > shipping box that indicated rebuilt.
> >
> > Oh, by the way, the battery is new. Only odd thing is that last night, the
> > temperature got down to 10 degrees below in our little podunk town, but
> > when
> > I was there for his exibition, it was mid day, and the interior was not
> > that
> > cold.
> >
> > Open for suggestions.
> > Thanks
> > Chuck
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Vwdiesel mailing list
> > Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Vwdiesel mailing list
> > Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 16:33:20 -0800 (PST)
> From: doonboggle <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: mark shepherd <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>, Tad <tadc at europa.com>
> Cc: vw fans <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Message-ID: <191987.82095.qm at web81401.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> I'll have to get that, if I can, from the 'expert', tomorrow.
>
> But what would that tell me?
> Thanks
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 00:38:11 -0000
> From: "mark shepherd" <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: "vw fans" <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Message-ID: <D12000097EEE47D38C64DF4FA459D2C0 at mark>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Could be corroded power terminals on the solenoid, or still possibly ignition switch not passing enough current.
> What's the current required to pull the solenoid on a starter?
>
> Mark
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Tad
> To: mark shepherd
> Cc: vw fans ; doonboggle
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:30 AM
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
>
>
> The 'clunk' would be the solenoid, so that would imply that the key circuit is working.
>
>
> Check the part number on the starter.
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 4:20 PM, mark shepherd <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> Could be that you've wasted money, as it may be your ignition switch giving
> out, and not a starter issue at all... :o(
>
> Mark
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "doonboggle" <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:13 AM
> Subject: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
>
>
>
> Recently joined after puirchasing a 1981 rabbit diesel pickup with 1.6L
> engine. I am no longer 'my mechanic' due to having some disks in my spine
> bolted-screwed together a few years ago, and not as nimble as I used to be.
>
> So took it to a local 'vw expert', who turned out to not be so expert ...
> when it comes to diesels ... only air cooled it seems.
>
> One of the things he advised right away was that the starter (apparently
> original) was 'shot'. So I went looking, and found a fellow who said he had
> one for that year that he bought a few years ago, had never used, and that
> it was "rebuilt". So bought it.
>
> Took to the expert, and today, after doing a valve job, and supposedly
> retiming the injector pump (my command), he called and said the rebuilt one
> was 'shot' also. He took me to the truck on his floor, and turned the key.
> Immediately it started, which seemed to surprise him. So he turned it off,
> and sure enough, it took about 3-4-5 more key 'on' before it engaged ...
> with just a clunk in the background.
>
> So am wondering ... could this rebuilt starter be for a gas rather than
> diesel? Does it make a difference? Dummie me never considered this. To me,
> starter is starter.
>
> If no difference, what could it possibly be? I have no reason to disbelieve
> the fellow who sold it to me, and it did in fact come in the original
> shipping box that indicated rebuilt.
>
> Oh, by the way, the battery is new. Only odd thing is that last night, the
> temperature got down to 10 degrees below in our little podunk town, but when
> I was there for his exibition, it was mid day, and the interior was not that
> cold.
>
> Open for suggestions.
> Thanks
> Chuck
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Vwdiesel mailing list
> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Vwdiesel mailing list
> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 00:40:20 -0000
> From: "mark shepherd" <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: "vw fans" <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Message-ID: <17D1B84154FB4D12AD9F2F68F60E5C4A at mark>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Best to have the starter on a bench and tickle it into life directly with a
> battery...Or not...;o)
>
> Mark
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "doonboggle" <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> To: "mark shepherd" <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>; "Tad" <tadc at europa.com>
> Cc: "vw fans" <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, December 09, 2009 12:33 AM
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
>
>
> >
> > I'll have to get that, if I can, from the 'expert', tomorrow.
> >
> > But what would that tell me?
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Vwdiesel mailing list
> > Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 16:52:24 -0800
> From: Tad <tadc at europa.com>
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Starter problems-vw rabbit diesel pickup
> To: doonboggle <doonboggle at yahoo.com>
> Cc: vw fans <Vwdiesel at vwfans.com>, mark shepherd
> <mark at shepher.fsnet.co.uk>
> Message-ID:
> <47fd54fd0912081652k637d6bd4gc83d327f27445488 at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Well you (or preferably the mechanic) should be able to look up the part #
> and determine if it's for a diesel. The diesel, as you suspected, requires
> a significantly stronger starter (due to higher compression).
>
> If it started "strongly" when it did start, I'd suspect an electrical issue
> (solenoid or key circuit, or maybe ground). If it started 'weakly' (like it
> had a dead battery), I'd guess it was the wrong starter... but that's just a
> guess.
>
> On Tue, Dec 8, 2009 at 4:33 PM, doonboggle <doonboggle at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > I'll have to get that, if I can, from the 'expert', tomorrow.
> >
> > But what would that tell me?
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 21:21:00 -0500
> From: "mikitka" <mikitka at embarqmail.com>
> Subject: [Vwdiesel] Window regulator
> To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Message-ID: <021e01ca7876$4033a180$c09ae480$@com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Just some info for anyone that might be looking for a window regulator for
> their VW. The left rear regulator went out in my 91 Jetta and I found one
> from www.autoanything.com for $17 new. I never thought I would find one
> new but they had it. To bad they do not have the seals. Mine are shot
> around all four windows.
>
>
>
> Nick
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Vwdiesel mailing list
> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>
>
> End of Vwdiesel Digest, Vol 74, Issue 23
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