[Vwdiesel] Veggie oil

Thu Jul 26 12:01:10 PDT 2012

On Jul 26, 2012, at 2:00 PM, dieseltdi at verizon.net wrote:

> Is this in the PD?  If so you are experiencing the classic symptoms of alcohol vapor lock.  Excess methanol in the biodiesel vaporizes in the injectors and the two stage pump at shut down causing hard starting.  I have just recently begun to wash my diesel and though it is a big pain, I haven't had hard start problems since.  Look at some of the links off of the Duda diesel site.  I have also bought a titration kit because the 300 gallons of oil I bought wouldn't react like I thought it should.  Turns out it has a high FFA content. it requires a 9.3 grams of lye per liter.  That is over 3 times what I am used to using.  Hayden
> 
> On Jul 26, 2012, at 10:36 AM, Bryan Belman <dieselwesty at yahoo.com> wrote:
> 
>> Just last night I put 3 gallons of "not a perfect batch" of home make bio diesel into my TDI with unit injectors.
>> The first start was fine.  Ran home from the guys house where we mix to get something, went to restart and had to crank the motor 2 times with about 5 seconds of cranking on each attempt before it would start.  Once started, it ran fine and did not stumble.  Another start that night was the same, hard and seemed like it may not start at all.
>> So, got up extra early this morning in case the car did not start and I would have to drive the Van to work.
>> It started up just like normal.  OK?
>> Then, I get out 10 miles to the rest stop where I pick up my commuting buddy, I shut the car down, go to restart 3 minutes later and it is hard starting again for sure.  2 attemps, 5-6 seconds of cranking.
>> But, when it started, it ran fine.
>> I do not think the WVO mixes very well or at all with the diesel, I think it goes right to the bottom of the tank.
>> 
>> so, I am going to hold off on putting any more of my home made bio into the PD motor until we get the process down better.  I had some minor starting issues with it in the IDI engines.
>> 
>> 
>> Bryan Belman, Pt. Pleasant, NJ
>> 04 Jetta Wagon TDI PD, 100hp, 5sp -- running :<)
>> 92 Jetta 1.6 Eco-Turbo Diesel, 5sp -- running :<)
>> 82 Diesel Westy 1.9NA -- running :<)
>> 70 Type 1 stock Elm Green Beetle -- Under Restoration :-)
>> From: "dieseltdi at verizon.net" <dieseltdi at verizon.net>
>> To: Dave Cook <davevw at yahoo.com> 
>> Cc: vw fans <vwdiesel at vwfans.com> 
>> Sent: Thursday, July 26, 2012 9:45 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Veggie oil
>> 
>> Dave. the size and pressure of the TDI injectors as well as the internal complexities of the pump, makes running a mix of oil/diesel in the TDI a very expensive and risky business.  Even suspended/dissolved in diesel, the mixture would be much more viscous than the system is designed for.  Also coking of the injectors and the pump itself, I suspect, would be more probably due to the higher temperature of operation.  If you wish to use WVO, you really need a two tank system with a heater of some sort to bring the oil to temperature to lower its viscosity. In my previous TDI, running biodiesel, I had to replace the fuel temp sensor in the pump twice due to some unknown property of the biodiesel that would wreck havoc with it.  I cannot imagine what veg oil would do to that sensor!  Just my two sense worth.  Hayden
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 26, 2012, at 8:36 AM, Dave Cook wrote:
>> 
>>> I've mentioned it before, but several years ago, I ran veggie oil in my old 1.6 NA-powered cabriolet.  I got oil from the local Chipotle restaurant.  They only fry tortillas for chips, so it was always pretty clean.  I simply filtered the oil to remove the particles, and mixed it 50/50 in the tank.  I would guesstimate the required amount of fuel to fill the tank, add half that value in oil, and drive straight to the filling station to top off with diesel.  (Only live 3 or 4 blocks away, so no big deal.)  I pretty much did this Spring - Fall when the weather was warm enough to not worry about the oil solidifying.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> This setup seemed to work just fine, and I put many miles on that car with no problems other than having to replace a couple fuel filters before I normally would have (which i solved by installing a cheapo sacrificial filter before the main filter).
>>> 
>>> At the time, I always told people that I felt OK with the setup in the old-fashioned diesel engine, but would "never" do it in a TDI with it's closer tolerances and (I assumed, anyway) more expensive parts.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I eventually sold the car and stopped picking up the oil from Chipotle.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Fast forward to now.
>>> 
>>> I currently drive an '02 Golf TDI.  I was in the restaurant recently and the manager asked about the diesel cars and mentioned that nobody is taking their oil, so it is available.
>>> 
>>> That in mind, I'm starting to wonder about doing the same thing I did before-just mixing some percentage of oil with the diesel fuel in the warmer months.  I am not interested in all the work of doing a full dual fuel system and collecting the amount of oil necessary to make that worthwhile.  The amount I'd get from Chipotle is pretty manageable and as a percentage would work out about right.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> So, if it worked in the old car, is it safe to assume it would work in the newer car?  Am I being too paranoid about damaging something?  
>>> 
>>> Thoughts?
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Dave Cook
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Vwdiesel mailing list
>>> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
>>> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/vwdiesel
>> 
>> "We're going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that have allowed some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. They sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying 10% of his salary – and that's crazy. Do you think the millionaire ought to pay more in taxes than the busdriver?  Ronald Reagan
>> 
>> “I cannot help fearing that men may reach a point where they look on every new theory as a danger, every innovation as a toilsome trouble, every social advance as a first step toward revolution, and that they may absolutely refuse to move at all.”  Alexis de Tocqueville
>> 
>> 
>> Visit my website at:  http://mysite.verizon.net/resosxp8/mydieselpages/
>> Proud owner of:
>> 2004 Jetta GL PD TDI
>> 1968 Beetle, my latest project, watch for details
>> 1982 VW Jetta Coupe with GTD turbo diesel transplant (in progress)
>> And many, many, many VWs; from a 1947 Beetle (13 Beetles total), to Vans (5 - 3 splitties, 2 bay window (both were campers), 1 Vanagon Westy, Rabbits (3), Karmen Ghia (1), Jettas (9), Passats (2), Dasher (1), New Beetle (1), Rabbit Convertible (1) and Rabbit Pickups (3) most now gone but not forgotten.
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>> _______________________________________________
>> Vwdiesel mailing list
>> Vwdiesel at vwfans.com
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>> 
>> 
> 
> "We're going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that have allowed some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. They sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying 10% of his salary – and that's crazy. Do you think the millionaire ought to pay more in taxes than the busdriver?  Ronald Reagan
> 
> “I cannot help fearing that men may reach a point where they look on every new theory as a danger, every innovation as a toilsome trouble, every social advance as a first step toward revolution, and that they may absolutely refuse to move at all.”  Alexis de Tocqueville
> 
> 
> Visit my website at:  http://mysite.verizon.net/resosxp8/mydieselpages/
> Proud owner of:
> 2004 Jetta GL PD TDI
> 1968 Beetle, my latest project, watch for details
> 1982 VW Jetta Coupe with GTD turbo diesel transplant (in progress)
> And many, many, many VWs; from a 1947 Beetle (13 Beetles total), to Vans (5 - 3 splitties, 2 bay window (both were campers), 1 Vanagon Westy, Rabbits (3), Karmen Ghia (1), Jettas (9), Passats (2), Dasher (1), New Beetle (1), Rabbit Convertible (1) and Rabbit Pickups (3) most now gone but not forgotten.
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"We're going to close the unproductive tax loopholes that have allowed some of the truly wealthy to avoid paying their fair share. They sometimes made it possible for millionaires to pay nothing, while a bus driver was paying 10% of his salary – and that's crazy. Do you think the millionaire ought to pay more in taxes than the busdriver?  Ronald Reagan

“I cannot help fearing that men may reach a point where they look on every new theory as a danger, every innovation as a toilsome trouble, every social advance as a first step toward revolution, and that they may absolutely refuse to move at all.”  Alexis de Tocqueville

Visit my website at:  http://mysite.verizon.net/resosxp8/mydieselpages/
Proud owner of:
2004 Jetta GL PD TDI
1968 Beetle, my latest project, watch for details
1982 VW Jetta Coupe with GTD turbo diesel transplant (in progress)
And many, many, many VWs; from a 1947 Beetle (13 Beetles total), to Vans (5 - 3 splitties, 2 bay window (both were campers), 1 Vanagon Westy, Rabbits (3), Karmen Ghia (1), Jettas (9), Passats (2), Dasher (1), New Beetle (1), Rabbit Convertible (1) and Rabbit Pickups (3) most now gone but not forgotten.