Re: Reality

["Randall C. Markarian" <asenna@accessus.net>]

QSHIPQ@aol.com wrote:
> 
> As I read with keen interest on the subject of the "superiority" of awd, I
> smile some; despite some rather dubious claims of awd track car prowess, that
> this rarely, in fact, just doesn't translate to street car variables...
>  About a year ago, I went on an ernest quest to determine how production
> autos faired in recent years with this exact debate.  In fact, more
> specifically, I really wanted to understand how I needed to load the deck in
> my favour, as sibling rivalry had plopped a awd Stealth tt into my brothers
> garage.  A formidible task, but some interesting DOCUMENTED results, street,
> track and racing venues here in the US.
> 

> With reference to the Mitsus:  fine machines, tho neither the awd talons, or
> the covetted 3k/stealthtt 320hp beast show the true advantages of awd in
> these tests or at the track in stock form....  In fact, as I have posted
> before, the summations of them is usually a reference to how effortlessly you
> get the speed, but not from sitting at the top of the pole.  The 3k/tt got
> close, no doubt, but the RX7tt and the Toyota Supra tt got the prize, both
> rwd cars.....  

Both much lighter than the 3000gt.

> One could argue that the tweeks applied to the awd might
> easily surpass the efforts of these formidible rwd cars, my point, and the
> point of these exercises, is to compare street stock available machines.  My
> research has yet to find the awd cars on top when comparing "apples to
> apples", save my hi hp argument with the 993....  Do they raise the standard
> above some of the faster machines?  You bet, R&T put the 3k/tt above the
> corvette in one of the tests, that's formidible (maybe not, another
> post).....
> 
> I am firmly committed, as this list knows, to understand, tweek, modify,
> evaluate, tweek again, to find the ultimate q...  My resume and background is
> long in this continual execution, some steps backward to go forward, but
> hardly less than true passion for me.  All claims aside, here in the states,
> one can run all the results of even the race venues and find awd coming up
> short.  Though audi has an S6 and and S4 running in luxury car, it's
> interesting to note that Renntech is OVERALL #4 with a MB, audis way down
> that list, and mitsu 3k/tt is far from the front, all, btw, to front engine,
> rwd cars...  Even the formidible Mitsus on individual and overall standings,
> just don't do the awd argument justice here in the states, it's documented.
>  British sure, germany sure, but I might argue (and have) the differences are
> more than here or than meets the eye , the superiority of awd here in the
> states, racing or street, just doesn't jive with the best of claimed
> testimonials here....  A cornering exit speed is just not enough applied
> physics in reality to make the awd superior....  A few have recited basic
> physics with the "given EQUAL blah blah" awd is superior, "eqaul" doesn't
> show up in any tests here in the states, and that's physics too...  The most
> interesting is the 320hp supra vs the 320hp 3k/tt, awd is not the winner...

WEIGHT WEIGHT WEIGHT.  
As one who is a scientist by trade (actually a dentist with significant
background in research), your basic premise is flawed.  In making any
type of comparision for the purpose of distinguishing between the two
different premises, one MUST factor out all other variables to know
whether the differences between the two are valid.  Therefore to say
that a BMW M3 is better on the street than a Q even though the Q has all
wheel drive is wrong.  The BMW is better because of a whole list of
other attributes that have nothing to do with AWD.  Why would the supra
test better that the 3000gt?  RWD....No!  Perhaps it is other attributes
of that car.  So what I am saying is that you cannot compare apples and
oranges and expect to get anything meaningful from the comparison.  So,
if you don't agree with that premise (of Real Research) I would be happy
to explain to you off of the list what it actually takes to remove other
variables and to make a meaningful comparison.
> 
> Scott

-- 

Randall C. Markarian

1990 V8 Quattro
1996 Merc E320

Saint Louis, Missouri