RE: License to....

["Avi Meron" <avi@cosmoslink.net>]

ALSO, let's not forget that the British government offered Ireland, NI if
they would declare war on Germany (during WW2) and Ireland
refused...........even after they were bombed by the Germans..............
Avi

-----Original Message-----
From:	owner-quattro@coimbra.ans.net [mailto:owner-quattro@coimbra.ans.net]
On Behalf Of Geoff Jenkins
Sent:	Saturday, October 17, 1998 6:11 PM
To:	Phil Payne; quattro@coimbra.ans.net
Subject:	RE: License to....


> > The British (and in their day, the Empire's allies) can take the
> > blame for events ranging from imperial adventures around the globe to N.
> > Ireland. Who shall escape calumny?
>
> I might grant you Hamburg, Dresden and many earlier atrocities.
>
> But to suggest that "the British" are "responsible" for Northern
> Ireland's problems requires a little rewriting of history.   The
> greatest single problem Ireland has is that too many people refuse to
> forget what happened three hundred and more years ago.

I didn't say that they _are_ responsible, just that they __can__
_be_held_responsible_, nor would it be easy to identify the atrocities in
question. One side would certainly list Bloody Sunday, whereas the other
side(s) would and could defend that incident and cite the IRAs attempts at
revenge on the Parachute Regt. instead. Equally, what do you do with the
"Death on the Rock", Enniskillen and Brighton episodes? To quote/paraphrase
Bernard Wooly "It's one of those irregular verbs: I am a freedom fighter,
you are a rebel, he is a terrorist".

The reason I include NI in the list is simply that for a significant chunk
of the US population, events such as Bloody Sunday are as indefensible as
the Mai Lai's of the US's own past (which inturn, are defensible to some
Americans).

As I am British, even though I would stoutly defend the British Army's role
in NI, it would smack of hypocrisy to ignore the fact that it remains
indefensible in the eyes of many other people (including, presumably, some
listers).

My whole point is that almost all nations have some historical incidents or
periods which they regard as "unfortunate" or "unpleasant but necessary",
but which are regarded as atrocities or barbarism by other nations & groups.
Ask a Russian and a German about the fall of Berlin...

> Incidentally, if you talk to German survivors of the war, they hardly
> ever mention the great set-piece obliteration raids.  But they still
> involuntarily shiver when they remember the "Tiefflieger".  After the
> Germans finally lost control of the air, the Allies flew where and
> when they liked.  Pilots of aircraft like rocket-firing Typhoons would
> dive from 3000 feet with their engines almost windmilling, hopping
> over woods and hedges, looking for anything that moved.  That is what
> the survivors that _I_ met described to me as "the terror from the air".

Yes, exactly the same way that earlier in the war, the "Horror of the
Blitzkrieg" had been the hounding the Luftwaffe inflicted on anything moving
by day along the roads, be it retreating French & British troops, civilians
or whatever else.

Mandatory Audi Content: Just got this winter's catalog/brochure from The
Tire Rack. Inside, it states "For many enthusiasts... the the first snow
signals the end of driving fun". Would these be enthusiasts such as the
Lexus driver on the cover, or the BMWs inside? Me, I look to the first snow
as the start of whole new kind of driving fun. Must be something to do with
not driving a Lexus or a Bimmer...

Geoff