RE: world's worst brake pads

["Mairs, James" <jmairs@cabletron.com>]

In my experience, and with others I know running ATE power disks and PBR
pads I can say the following:

The Rotors are great, I love the concept of grooved, but not too the edges
to avoid cracking.  The wear limit is the groove depth, so you will know
when they are at/beyond the limit.  Grooves do seem to collect/expel debris.
I probably will never do another set of stock rotors, I will either use ATE
PD'S or try cross drilled.

But here is some advice from a BTDT remove the PBR's and try something else,
your ATE PD'S's will loose the 'battle' against the PBR's, you will
eventually end up with ¾ pad and ¼ rotor 'depth' left.  The heavier Audi's
seem to harder on the ATE PD'S's than the lighter VW's.  

I only understand the very basics of brakes, but I would imagine a softer
(COF) would provide better braking and long term wear, in terms of a street
car.  I am of course relating this to a street driven car, not racing
experience, only what I have seen on 4 cars running ATE PD'S's and PBR's.  I
will try a different pad on my next set of brakes.
 
Interestingly enough, I can agree with every thing I have ever heard about
PBR's, they come on weak and can be scary during the first portion of an
'emergency' stop, but after applying they grip up very well.  I also thought
they gripped better after being brought up to temp and were a little 'light'
leaving the drive way in the winter mornings, pedal feel was there as well
as the first squeak of the morning.  As for the squeaks that everyone
complains about, that only starting happening after about 20K, before that
it was only on the first application during that drive.  Don't know why, but
they were quiet until about 20K.  Shrug



-- Jim


James C. Masaru Mairs		84 VW Callaway Turbo MK1 GTi
Cabletron ~ Web Operations		91 VW Golf MK2 GTi 8v
Phone: 603-337-1150			83 Audi Ur-Q
email: jmairs@cabletron.com <mailto:jmairs@cabletron.com> 	

		-----Original Message-----
		From:	Huw Powell [mailto:audi@mediaone.net]
		Sent:	Tuesday, October 26, 1999 2:36 AM
		To:	Audi Fans
		Subject:	world's worst brake pads

		I only wish I knew what they were.  Came mounted on some
rebuilt 85 4kq
		calipers I bought when I went to 16v scirocco rotors (10"
vented, 4 x
		100).  Ever since that supposed brake upgrade I have had
pulling, a soft
		pedal and all sorts of irritating brake attitude.

		So I threw on some Ate power discs (did I mention the new
rotors also
		had a nice warp developed as well) and new PBR something
pads.  These
		pads were sorta cool looking, if you like cancer - they
actually were
		fuzzy and white on the friction face and reminded me of the
asbestos
		covered pipes we used to swing from in the locker room after
soccer
		practice.

		But I digress.  

		These went on Saturday.  No playing with fluid at all (The
pulling/soft
		pedal made me think I had some bubbles).  Now the brakes
feel right. 
		soft grab right away with a firmer and firmer feel as I
press.  The
		atomic grooves in the rotors have filled up nicely with pad
material
		(someone should market colored pads to go with these
rotors!) and there
		is no pull, etc, etc.  I also replaced my rear bearings
cause I was
		bored but I didn't touch the rear brakes at all (the
vibration back
		there is the really old Contis I guess)

		So I wonder what those crap pads were so I could slag
them...  and why
		caliper rebuilders would use them?

		-- 
		Huw Powell

		http://www.humanspeakers.com/audi/

		82 Audi Coupe; 84 4kq; 85 Coupe GT; 73 F250