Bump Starting
Henry A Harper III
hah at alumni.rice.edu
Sun Dec 1 00:46:10 EST 2002
The starter solenoid terminals are so-labeled in Bentley, there is one that
is 38/30 and one is 36/87.These numbers are probably on the terminal block,
I believe that the 30 and 87 are part of the standard (ISO?) wiring
labeling scheme; 30 is "hot" with +12V and 87 is switched by the relay with
another pair of contacts. From the diagram this is a simple four-terminal
relay (alam unit can interrupt starter function by not powering the relay
coils), so by removing the relay and jumping a single wire from the 38/30
terminal to the 36/87 terminal you would eliminate the control authority of
the anti-theft unit. I suppose it's possible the anti-theft control unit
might get angry if you don't jump the other pair of (control) terminals for
the relay, to give it a ground path. But in theory, to get the starter to
work regardless of the alarm's status you only need the one wire jumper.
HTH
Henry
On Saturday, November 30, 2002 7:46 PM, Kneale Brownson
[SMTP:knotnook at traverse.com] wrote:
> Thanks, again, Henry. So if I have another 332 014 156 relay around that
> MIGHT fix the current problem? If not, I'd use two separate wire loops
> with spade connectors on the ends to make the jumpers you suggest?
>
> At 06:48 PM 11/30/2002 -0700, Henry A Harper III wrote:
>
> >Ah, relay #8 is described in Bentley as the "anti-theft relay" - it
would
> >be supposed to prevent you from starting the car after the alarm was
> >activated, looks like the starter solenoid activation track does run
> >through it from the ignition switch. Looks like you could remove relay
#8
> >and jumper terminal 38/30 to terminal 36/87 if you want to remove the
> >anti-theft system's control over the starter. (vol 3, page 537) The
> >lock-out-all-other-things-during-starter-operation relay is also known
as
> >the load reduction relay, it is #5 underhood. That one just happens to
> >power a lot of things (headlights, horn, etc.) and just it isn't turned
on
> >when the key is in start position.
> >
> >Henry
> >
> >On Saturday, November 30, 2002 5:20 PM, Kneale Brownson
> >[SMTP:knotnook at traverse.com] wrote:
> > > Thanks, Henry. Perhaps I misunderstood Audi's labeling of the relay
in
> > > Position 8 of the underhood relay/fuse box. Relay Part # 332 014 156
is
> > > called something like "starter lock-out". Maybe its purpose is to
lock
> >out
> > > all other electrical functions during starter use and it doesn't
prevent
> > > the starter itself from operating????
> > >
> > > At 02:56 PM 11/30/2002 -0700, Henry A Harper III wrote:
> > >
> > > >I don't think there is such a relay on our (VW-Audi) cars. The
ignition
> > > >switch is designed to only allow one start actuation per off->run
cycle
> > > >(it's spring-loaded). If you can turn off the ignition and turn the
key
> > > >back to start before the engine stops, or not quite release the key
all
> >the
> > > >way in the run position and hit start again, I think you could get
some
> > > >expensive-sounding grinding noises.
> > > >
> > > >HTH
> > > >Henry Harper
> > > >http://www.henry-harper.com hah at alumni.rice.edu
> > > >1991 200 quattro, 116k
> > > >1988 GTI 16v, 233k
> > > >
> > > >On Saturday, November 30, 2002 11:29 AM, Kneale Brownson
> > > >[SMTP:knotnook at traverse.com] wrote:
> > > > > I didn't try a jump start because in the past, when the battery
has
> >not
> > > > > been up to spark potential, the starter solenoid would click or
> > > > > something. I'm getting no indication the "start" command is
going
> >from
> > > >the
> > > > > ignition key to the starter.
> > > > >
> > > > > Would the lock-out relay (the one that won't let you activate the
> >starter
> > > > > while the engine is running) cause the symptoms I've got? Is one
of
> >the
> > > > > relays under the dash a potential suspect?
> > > > >
> > > > > At 09:17 AM 11/30/2002 -0500, Ingo Rautenberg wrote:
> > > > > >Kneale,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Don't know how things turned out, but I wouldn't hesitate with
the
> >bump
> > > > > >starting, especially considering the dual cats and Motronic
(maybe
> >I'm
> > > >just
> > > > > >crazy ;-) . So nothing changed when you attempted a jump start?
> > > > Curious.
> > > > > >These cars are tough on batteries and even one that's slightly
> > > >discharged or
> > > > > >has a bad cell can "appear" to be good.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Keep us appraised.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Ingo
> > > > > >
> > > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > > >From: "Kneale Brownson" <knotnook at traverse.com>
> > > > > >To: <200q20v at audifans.com>
> > > > > >Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 2:43 PM
> > > > > >Subject: Bump Starting
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I was thinking of bumpstarting my 200q20v with the
nonresponsive
> > > >starter
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > > get it home to work on, but the Bentley warns against doing
that.
> > > > Says
> > > > > > > it's not good for the catalytic converter and "might damage
other
> > > > > > > parts". I could see how a bunch of raw gas going into the
cat
> > > >wouldn't be
> > > > > > > good for it, but my car was running great before I parked it,
so
> >I'd
> > > >think
> > > > > > > it would fire right up with just a couple turnovers via the
gear
> > > > > > > train. What else might get damaged? I'm thinking of towing
at
> >just
> > > >a
> > > > > > > couple miles an hour and letting the clutch out in fourth
gear.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > 200q20v mailing list
> > > > > > > 200q20v at audifans.com
> > > > > > > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/200q20v
> > > > > >
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>
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