[Biturbos4] Turbos Reliability & Replacement Cost (was: 2000 S4 Running Hot)

[Rohan Singh]

Thanks for the info Quincy. I'll begin to save up! Any
opinions on whether it is worth switching to Ko4's on
a car with around 100K kilometres (About 62K miles)?
I'm planning to keep the car to the very end so maybe
it is huh?

--- Quincy Chiang <b5quattro at shaw.ca> wrote:

> Hi Rohan and all,
> 
> I got this form someone on the AW B5-S4 forum today
> who recently went to Stage 3-.  Here're the cost of
> his upgrade (all prices below are USD):
> 
> $2,700 - K04 turbos w/ inlet pipes (supposedly K03s
> are more expensive than K04s!)
> $325 - Piggie downpipes
> $450 - RS4 clutch
> $40 - manual boost controller (required to run with
> K03 chipped software)
> $2,500-3,000 - Labour + miscellaneous stuff (hoses,
> RS4 engine and tranny mounts...)
> = $6515 USD
> (= $8144 Cdn)
> 
> Now if your car wasn't chipped before, than add the
> cost of that, about $700 depending on which flavour.
>  Then add $1000 for an exhaust to compliment the
> heavier breathing, all of a sudden you're sitting at
> $8,215.  if you're anywhere close to 60k miles, you
> better get the timing belt and water pump (and
> othere related stuff) done as well, so add another
> say $600.  The total comes to $8,815 ($11,019 Cdn). 
> What you get is a much more reliable torque monster,
> probably getting 350hp at the crank, not too shabby
> at all.
> 
> So lets say the turbos go in 3 years time, you'll
> have to save up $245/month starting now for this
> procedure.  But then we haven't even touched other
> stuff yet, like tires, brakes, suspension and other
> miscellaneous stuff that probably won't cost a whole
> lot to fix, but will seriously put a dent to you K04
> fund when you add them all up.
> 
> For me right now from the financial side of things,
> if sh!t hits the fan in say 3 years, I can probably
> afford to go Stage3-, but that means I'll have
> nothing that year going ito my savings and RRSP, and
> I'll be living pretty poorly for a while.  I can do
> it but common sense keep telling me this ain't
> right.
> 
> The worst part is, looking at the North American
> auto market for the next 2 model years, there's
> nothing out there I like and can afford.  The Mini
> Cooper S is the only car right now that I like... 
> I'm just freaking torn on what to do!
> 
> Quincy
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Rohan Singh <rohanj_singh at yahoo.com>
> Date: Tuesday, August 30, 2005 3:26 pm
> Subject: Re: [Biturbos4] Turbos Reliability &
> Replacement Cost (was: 2000 S4 Running Hot)
> 
> > The discussion about turbo failure always gives me
> the
> > jitters after hearing the mileage at which S4
> owners
> > experience this! I bought my 2001 S4 with a build
> date
> > of July 2000 in August last year in Toronto with
> 78K
> > kilometres - not miles. The car now has 103K
> > kilometres and the turbo's sound fine except for a
> > slight "dentist drill" sound when under load
> between
> > 1500 - 2200 rpm - I don't really remember hearing
> this
> > sound for the first few thousand kilometres after
> > buying it, but again I am beginning to get to know
> my
> > car a lot more after tuning in to this forum and
> > perhaps I wasn't paying attention before. I can't
> hear
> > any sound at very low rpms or above 2200 RPM. I
> have
> > no idea how the car was driven by the first owner
> but
> > the car was in great condition and completely
> stock
> > when I bought it from an Audi dealer with the 2
> year
> > certified warranty. I have kept the car stock and
> > changed the oil (synthetic) every 4000 kilometres
> > since 78K. The car runs beautifully and I enjoy
> > driving it every single day - never fails to give
> me a
> > rush! I always warm up and cool down. I keep
> wondering
> > at what point I am going to experience turbo
> failure.
> > I do know that if the cost of replacing a turbo is
> > around $7K Canadian and this happened after my
> audi
> > assured warranty expired next July, I would go
> ahead
> > and do it. Just the taxes on a new audi A4 (lets
> say
> > 50 grand after really loading it up) come close to
> 60%
> > of that cost! I feel that the styling is timeless
> and
> > that it will go down as an Audi classic. Does
> anyone
> > know about the total cost of upgrading to to a
> full
> > package for the K04's (turbo's, chip, exhaust,
> > etc.)and if there are any independent shops in
> Toronto
> > that do this kind of work? If my turbo's go, they
> had
> > better do so before my Audi Assured warranty
> expires
> > next summer! Maybe I should just drive my car hard
> for
> > the next few months hoping that they will die out
> > before the warranty expires!
> > 
> > Rohan
> > '01 S4 Manual
> > 
> > --- Quincy Chiang <b5quattro at shaw.ca> wrote:
> > 
> > > Hi Grant, JY and all,
> > > 
> > > This has been an interesting and informative
> > > discussion.  From what I've read and heard on
> these
> > > list and AW forums, it seems like luck has more
> to
> > > do with the turbos failing than anything else. 
> > > Obviously chipping kills them a lot sooner, and
> > > people they have chipped their 2.7t should
> realize
> > > that, but even non-chipped car are not safe from
> it
> > > either.  Someone on this list 2 weeks ago (sorry
> I
> > > forgot who) had his turbos bit the dust at the
> > > tender age of 52k miles, and he supposedly
> followed
> > > all the usual procedures like proper warmup,
> > > cooldown and uses synthetic oil, and his car
> wasn't
> > > chipped.
> > > 
> > > So we've established how and why the turbos fail
> (ok
> > > maybe not, it still seems more like a black
> art), my
> > > next question is how many owners are actually
> > > willing to shell out $7500 Cdn ($6000 USD) to
> > > replace those pesky K03s when they meet their
> maker?
> > > 
> > > Based on the above and maybe one other recent
> > > failure cases (both cars not chipped), lets say
> the
> > > turbos die at somewhere around 55,000 miles
> > > (~88,500km), right now I'm more than half way
> there,
> > > and I expect to get there within 3 years.  At
> that
> > > mileage, I'd definitely have the timing belt job
> > > done while the engine's out, and perhaps replace
> the
> > > clutch as well, so that'd bring the total to
> nearly
> > > $10,000 Cdn ($8000 USD).  But here's the kicker,
> why
> > > would you put in K03s and you can get K04s for
> just
> > > a little more money?  It makes sense from the
> > > reliability perspective, and I'm not one to
> refuse
> > > some extra power.  But once you do that, it
> quickly
> > > snowballs into other things to get a decent
> stage 3-
> > > setup, like K03 chip/software, higher fuel
> pressure
> > > regulator, MBC, exhaust and maybe downpipes. 
> Then
> > > you'll need some custom tuning with a VAG-COM,
> which
> > > can be fun and/or frustrating at the same time.
> > > 
> > > The thing is that once the turbos die, you now
> must
> > > replace them just to get the car running,
> otherwise
> > > the car's worthless, can't even sell it.  And
> once
> 
=== message truncated ===



		
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