2.3 NF block with MC-1 head?

[ben swann]

Quattrophile,

I got a lot of good answers to my earlier question of merit of using
the NF block with MC head and turbo setup.  It seems that it wouldn't
be worth it in my case as there is little to gain.  So, 'nother
question.

How about using an NG head and intake manifold to install on the MC
block.  My initial thoughts are it would actually lower compression a
tad, and wouldn't really change displacement.  Doesn't it have larger
valves and flow better?

As Huw alluded to earlier, some of us have all these spare parts laying
around we need to put to good use.  Plus I always like spawning a good
thread or three.

Ben
1 - worked over MC-1 engine with goodies coming out of recently wrecked
5ktqa
1 - worked over NG motor with goodies supposed to go into a 4kq for
over a year now
1 - NF block
4 or 5 KX?  4000Q motors mostly still running fine in their cars which
really deserve more power.
1 - 3B in '91 200 20vtqa - no I ain't gonna tough that one - anytime
soon, but if someone has one laying around I can play with...

----- Original Message -----
From: Mihnea Cotet <mik at info.fundp.ac.be>
Date: Thursday, February 20, 2003 5:56 pm
Subject: RE: Re: 2.3 NF block with MC-1 head?

> One more 0.02 to add, particularly for Alan, even the american
> KX/JT 2.2s  > that had 8.5:1 CR had the same head as the KV so the
head comb > chamber > really is identical no matter the CR.
>
> HTH,
>
> Mihnea
>
> At 12:40 20/02/2003 -0500, JShadzi at aol.com wrote:
> >Alan, the 2.3 has a compression of 10:1 stock, the 2.2 has a
> compression > >of 10:1 stock, the comb. chambers in the two heads are
identical, > there is > >no change of compression by switching to an
identical head comb. > chamber > >as the one the motor originally had.
> >
> >Javad
> >
> > >Just want to confirm my thoughts on this for my turbo project.
> My engine> > >consists of a kv bottom end (2226) and an ng head
(2309), both > engines are> > >spec'd at 10:1 compression ratio.
> > >KV engine: 81 Bore, 86.4 Stroke> > >NG Engine : 82.5 Bore, 86.4
Stroke> > >So capacity of each cylinder =
> > >KV 2226/5 = 445.2
> > >NG  2309/5 = 461.8
> > >Therefore for both engines to have 10:1 compression ratio, at
> tdc the volume
> > >above the piston must be:
> > >KV 445.2/10 = 44.52
> > >NG 461.8/10 = 46.18
> > >So logic dictates that if the ng head is fitted to the kv
> bottom, the> > >compression will be lowered: so working on the fact
that my > 2226 engine now> > >has 46.18 cc above the piston at tdc
gives me....> > >2226/5 (capacity of cylinder) = 445.2/46.18 (new
volume above > piston) = 9.64:1> > >Does this follow, or have I missed
something, my goal has > always been 8psi.
> > >my head says yes, but when I posted before no one could back me up.
> > >
> > >Best Regards,
> > >Alan Pritchard
> > >Network Administrator
> > >
> > >Seaeye Marine Ltd.
> > >
> > >Tel.  01329 289000
> > >Fax. 01329 289001
> > >www.seaeye.com
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Mihnea Cotet [mik at info.fundp.ac.be]
> > >Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 9:45 PM
> > >To: duandcc_forums at cox.net; ben swann; JShadzi at aol.com
> > >Cc: quattro at audifans.com; benswann at comcast.net
> > >Subject: Re: Re: 2.3 NF block with MC-1 head?
> > >
> > >Oh right, he was talking about making a turbo 2.3 10v.... bad
> idea indeed,
> > >only maximum 5 psi are possible with some very high octane fuel
> and much> > >retarded ignition timing... However, lowering the CR a
tad to > say 9.5:1 and> > >a pretty good ignition control system would
allow him to have a > setup> >similar to the 20vt... not a very bad
idea! I'll try to > look into making a> > >9:1 CR 10vt with a good
ignition system (accurate is the word, > I have the> > >timing values
for 20vt engines so transposing these values on > the 10v> > >engine
won't be the issue, accuracy of the spark control will > instead) and>
> >a nice turbo as well... sounds like fun anyway!
> > >
> > >Mihnea
> > >
> > >At 16:15 18/02/2003 -0500, duandcc_forums at cox.net wrote:
> > >>Your right, it's not the head that's the problem, it's the
> block. NF => > >>10.1:1, same as my NG. I doubt you could run much,
if any, > boost through a> > >>10.1:1 CR engine without some pretty
sophisticated engine > management stuff> > >>(like they use on modern
1.8Ts, gost I miss my chipped passat > 1.8T).> >>
> > >>Dave
> > >>
> > >> >
> > >> > From: Mihnea Cotet <mik at info.fundp.ac.be>
> > >> > Date: 2003/02/18 Tue PM 03:59:58 EST
> > >> > To: <duandcc_forums at cox.net>, ben swann <benswann at comcast.net>,
> > >> >  JShadzi at aol.com
> > >> > CC: quattro at audifans.com, benswann at comcast.net
> > >> > Subject: Re: 2.3 NF block with MC-1 head?
> > >> >
> > >> > Why would he? The compression ratio is given by the
> pistons, not the> > >head
> > >> > AFAIK..
> > >> >
> > >> > Mihnea
> > >> >
> > >> > At 15:40 18/02/2003 -0500, duandcc_forums at cox.net wrote:
> > >> > >I'm pretty sure you'd end up with WAY too high of a
> compresion ratio to
> > >a
> > >> > >turbo engine...
> > >> > >
> > >> > >Dave
> > >> > >1987 CGT Special Build
> > >> > >SE Virginia
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > From: ben swann <benswann at comcast.net>
> > >> > > > Date: 2003/02/18 Tue PM 01:32:02 EST
> > >> > > > To: JShadzi at aol.com
> > >> > > > CC: quattro at audifans.com,  benswann at comcast.net
> > >> > > > Subject: 2.3 NF block with MC-1 head?
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Javad, Quattrophile,
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Just a thought.  I have an NF block and was looking
> into the> > >> > > > possibility of installing my MC-1 turbo head to
have a
> 2.3 MC-1
> > >setup.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Can it be done without shaving the head or block?
> Issues?  Worth it?
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Ben
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > [From: JShadzi at aol.com
> > >> > > > was -Re: 80tq: Head Gasket Failure
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Just a standard one this time around, this motor is
> temporary but> > >I'm> > >> > > > researching using the S6 gasket in
the 2.3 motor, > thought the bore> > >is> > >> > > > bigger.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > Javad]