Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)

Thu Apr 15 11:32:13 EDT 2004

Yeah, that's been on my mind too.  I've tried the propane trick with no
discoveries, but I would like to be more sure.  Of course I've combed the
entire engine compartment with no luck, but those hoses are everywhere.  I
still look for leaks every trip out to the garage.  I wish there was a sure
fire way to find those pesky leaks- like pressurizing the vac system, but I
haven't figured out a way.  I have had a lot of vac leaks with my '83 5kT,
but those have been relatively easy to find- on that vintage, hoses crack or
blow off fairly regularly, and I've been all over that engine, and know
where to look.  I had a plug on the IM blow off out in the boonies once, and
couldn't find anything suitable to plug it with.  In a MacGuyver moment, I
ended up using a door lock knob, which is nicely tapered and fit snugly
inside the port that was formerly capped by a rubber plug.  As long as I
kept the boost low, it stayed in and sealed enough to get me home.  I was
proud of that one!

Charley 

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From: Robert Myers [mailto:robert at s-cars.org] 
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 9:10 AM
To: DePenning, Charles [EPM/MTN]
Subject: RE: Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)

Sounds like you've been just about everywhere I suggested.

How about vacuum leaks?  I dunno what sort of problems your NA engine will
have with leaks but they are a MAJOR source of problems with forced
induction engines.  Could there be an overlooked broken or missing hose
somewhere or one with a well hidden major split or the like?

At 10:02 AM 4/15/2004 -0500, you wrote:

Yep yep yep.  Air filter was an 'a-ha' - thought that might be it about two
weeks ago- but no dice.  Spark for all five leads great.  Ignition side
looks fine by all perspectives- from the plugs to the coil.  When the car
WAS running, I checked the timing as best I could (with crappy idle and all)
and it looked to be about right- about 12 deg BTDC.  Compression is great-
140-150 psi evenly across all cyl.

It's really acting like the timing is severely off.  I checked the alignment
between the crank and cam shafts in another moment of 'a-ha'. But they
looked good as well.  I wonder about things like the hall-effect on the
dist.  I've got a 'scope, so I should see if I'm getting the proper signal
with no discontinuities there.

Oh yeah, new injectors too.  I thought that might help.  Guess not!

Frick Frack.

Charley 

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From: Robert Myers [mailto:robert at s-cars.org <mailto:robert at s-cars.org> ] 
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2004 8:47 AM
To: DePenning, Charles [EPM/MTN]
Subject: Re: Not-running 90q (was poorly-running)

You need fuel, air, and spark (at the right time) to have an engine fire.  I
guess we should add compression to that list.

You have fuel.
Is your air filter totally plugged?  (Perhaps by a chunk of plastic crap
drug in there by a rodent during storage?)
Have you checked for the presence of a spark?  If no spark check coil, and
internal dizzy parts - rotor and cap.  Ignition wires all connected?  All
continuous - no open circuits?  No severe insulation breaks?  Getting +12
volts to the coil?  Good ground connection for the coil?
Have you checked compression?  It should be somewhere not too far removed
from 150 psig and all cylinders should be within say +/- 10-15% of each
other.

At 08:47 AM 4/15/2004 -0500, you wrote:

I'm still scratching my head with my '89 90q that flatly refuses to run
right.  Very lumpy idle, no power at all, sounds like it's missing on a few
cylinders.  Happened suddenly at highway speed.  I've been working with the
assistance of folks on this list to cure the problem, working mainly on the
CIS side of things.  I've checked and double-checked about everything I can,
and all components look to be right in spec.  Exhaust is open- no clogged
cat.  Last night I just let the car run until it was well warmed-up, and the
missing behavior got worse and worse, until it sounded like it was running
on 2 cylinders, barely staying running, with some very strange 'clanking'
sounds coming from the engine- sounded like mechanical interference, but
might have been pre-detonation or knocking, which sounds similar.  Then it
died, and would not re-start.  I had a thought that maybe the gas was bad
enough after sitting for three months that maybe it was causing the problem-
not likely, but I've tried about everything else.  So I drained the gas from
the tank (using the fuel pump through the fuel return line in the engine
compartment) and put 5 gallons of fresh gas in the tank.  Still just
wouldn't start.  I waited until this morning, engine cool.  No start.
Before, I could at least get it to start and run lumpily.  Now nothing.  I
pulled all five plugs and checked spark at each- good.  Compression still
good.  Each cylinder smelled of gas and the plugs were slightly wet and I
could see a little gas on top of the pistons.  I am at a loss to find what
is steadily getting so non-functional that with fuel and spark both present,
I can't get the thing to even fire a little.  Any help would greatly be
appreciated!  

TIA,

Charley DePenning
'89 90q
'84 4kq
'83 5kT

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_____

Our Resident is a Son of a Bush.

Bob
*****
 Robert L. Myers 304-574-2372   
 Rt. 4, Box 57, Fayetteville, WV 25840 USA WV tag Q SHIP        
 '95 urS6 Cashmere Grey - der Wunderwagen  ICQ 22170244         
 http://www.airamericaradio.com <http://www.airamericaradio.com/>  
***** 

_____

Our Resident is a Son of a Bush.

Bob
*****
 Robert L. Myers 304-574-2372   
 Rt. 4, Box 57, Fayetteville, WV 25840 USA WV tag Q SHIP        
 '95 urS6 Cashmere Grey - der Wunderwagen  ICQ 22170244         
 http://www.airamericaradio.com <http://www.airamericaradio.com/>  
***** 