[BIRA] Re: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)

steve powers steve at thepowers.net
Wed Jun 25 23:14:19 EDT 2003


It's pretty hard to spin an H&R stud, considering it's threaded
just like the bolt it replaces. Spun studs are pressed in which
these definitely aren't.

Loosen? possibly
spin? no...

Steve

>  -----Original Message-----
>  From: Mark Strangways [mailto:strangconst at rogers.com]
>  Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2003 4:53 PM
>  To: 'TM'; '* S List'; 'BIRA ORG'
>  Subject: [BIRA] Re: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)
>
>
>  Well, ....
>  Where to start.
>  Personally I don't find it a problem to hoist a wheel up and
>  put it on the hub and line everything up. Either on the
>  floor jack or hoist doesn't matter. I can see some
>  advantages to studs, but not what this is all made out to
>  be. I have never had a bolt that I haven't been able to
>  remove, but I have had many a stud (GM typically) that spun
>  with-in the hub. Now that sucks. It is a tragic waste of
>  time farting around with a spun stud. Has even cost me a
>  steel rim many moons ago. So, I will keep my bolts. I will
>  also ** Antisieze** some rims. There I said it... Let the
>  games begin :-)
>
>  Mark S
>  ----- Original Message -----
>  From: "Scott Munger" <mungerts at uneedspeed.net>
>  To: "'TM'" <t44tq at mindspring.com>; "'* S List'"
>  <s-car-list at audifans.com>; "'BIRA ORG'" <birabrakes at yahoogroups.com>
>  Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2003 7:33 PM
>  Subject: RE: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)
>
>
>  > I now see the advantages, wise one.
>  >
>  > BTW, a "new to me" item on the topic,  I found this little
>  black rod
>  > in
>  the
>  > spare tire jack tool set.  Take 1 lug out, thread the rod in, then
>  > take
>  the
>  > others out.  Makes getting the wheel on/off very easy and the rotor
>  doesn't
>  > go anywhere when you take the brakes off.  If the rotors
>  were hot, it
>  > may just melt the little rod... maybe I'd upgrade to a
>  stud from the
>  > local
>  Home
>  > Depot.
>  >
>  > --Scott Munger
>  > '93 S4
>  > '97 Cabriolet
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > > -----Original Message-----
>  > > From: s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
>  > > [mailto:s-car-list-admin at audifans.com]On Behalf Of TM
>  > > Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2003 4:02 PM
>  > > To: mungerts at uneedspeed.net; '* S List'; 'BIRA ORG'
>  > > Subject: RE: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > Scott-
>  > > The big pro to using studs is that it makes it much,
>  much easier to
>  > > mount wheels because you're not fighting to hold the
>  wheel on the
>  > > hub while trying to thread a lug bolt into the hub- the
>  studs hold
>  > > the wheel easily, making the job much easier, whether it is
>  > > trackside for an autox or driver's ed event or on the
>  side of the
>  > > road in case of a flat tire or simply for the biannual
>  tire swap if
>  > > you're in the snow belt.
>  > >
>  > > The con to using studs is that stud replacement, should
>  you make a
>  > > mistake and damage the hub, requires removal and
>  replacement of the
>  > > hub (to the best of my knowledge, hubs are not
>  repairable easily or
>  > > cheaply),
>  > > wheel bearing and the offending stud. Also, the cost of
>  the studs as
>  > > well
>  > > as getting the length correct can be a minus.
>  > >
>  > > Taka
>  > >
>  > > -----Original Message-----
>  > > From: s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
>  > > [mailto:s-car-list-admin at audifans.com] On Behalf Of Scott Munger
>  > > Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 11:53 PM
>  > > To: 'steve powers'; 'northwest audi enthusiasts'; '* S
>  List'; 'BIRA
>  > > ORG'
>  > > Subject: RE: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > Would you mind explaining the pros/cons of lugs versus studs?
>  > >
>  > > --Scott Munger
>  > > '93 S4
>  > > '97 Cabriolet
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > > -----Original Message-----
>  > > > From: s-car-list-admin at audifans.com
>  > > > [mailto:s-car-list-admin at audifans.com]On Behalf Of steve powers
>  > > > Sent: Tuesday, June 24, 2003 8:33 PM
>  > > > To: 'northwest audi enthusiasts'; '* S List'; 'BIRA ORG'
>  > > > Subject: [s-cars] I'm finally studly... (long)
>  > > >
>  > > >
>  > > > (cross-posted to BIRA, S-cars and NW Audi)
>  > > >
>  > > > Since installing my BIRA Sys 6 brake setup, I wanted to
>  > > install wheel
>  > > > studs to make the wheel installation easier. At issue is the
>  > > > additional 3mm of rotor hat thickness which sort of
>  defeats the
>  > > > hub-centric wheels where you put on the wheel, spin
>  and slip in a
>  > > > bolt - all at once. Studs
>  > > > seemed like the best way to go, so I began researching
>  the problem.
>  > > >
>  > > > The urS6/S4s use a pretty hefty lug bolt size (14x1.5mm).
>  > > Removing one
>  > >
>  > > > lug bolt and measuring several times with a 16p nail,
>  > > hooking the head
>  > >
>  > > > on the backside of the hub, I came up with a stud
>  length target of
>  > > > 60mm overall length. I figured this length should allow for a
>  > > > to-be-sourced lug nut and still not protrude from the wheels.
>  > > >
>  > > > Calling a local vendor for H&R lugs I explained how I
>  measured and
>  > > > what I wanted. They got the lugs and I took them home.
>  They were
>  > > > wrong - too long by about 20mm! The studs consist of
>  three areas:
>  > > > hub thread, waist,
>  > > > and lug thread. The length H&R quotes is lug thread. It makes
>  > > > some sense
>  > > > as you are supposed to thread in the lugs, bottoming them out
>  > > > in the hub
>  > > > on the waist of the stud. Re-order, this time in H&R's
>  40mm length.
>  > > >
>  > > > Meanwhile, I need some nuts. The stock wheels (and my
>  3 piece HRE
>  > > > wheels) use a ball seat. The rub is that there just aren't any
>  > > > aftermarket ball seat lug nuts. I checked with Tire Rack and
>  > > > others, including searching the web. You can get the standard
>  > > > steel ones, which I did. (Note: most aftermarket
>  wheels use cone
>  > > > seats and you won't have this problem - it's just that mine
>  > > > didn't)
>  > > >
>  > > > I did discover though that Porsche also used 14x1.5mm
>  lugs. They
>  > > > previously used lug nuts (alloy even!) on all of their
>  cars but
>  > > > recently went to a funky lug bolt setup with spinning
>  ball seat
>  > > > collar. I went to the local P-car parts dept. and
>  bought one of
>  > > > the older
>  > > black anodized
>  > > > allot lug nuts. It was the right thread pitch and may
>  fit, though
>  > > > I wouldn't know until I installed the studs.
>  > > >
>  > > > I got the new studs today. I immediately removed a lug bolt
>  > > and put in
>  > >
>  > > > a stud. It fits! I jacked up the car and installed all
>  the studs
>  > > > using red loctite and torqued them to 100 lb-ft with a
>  double nut.
>  > > > I put the wheel
>  > > > back on and tightened a couple of the steel nuts on. I
>  > > measured to see
>  > > > if the stud would bottom out on the Porsche lugnut.
>  Nope, it will
>  > > > work. Yippee!
>  > > >
>  > > > Because I only had one Porsche nut, I installed the steel
>  > > nuts. I have
>  > >
>  > > > found an aftermarket supplier (www.boothedesign.com)
>  for Porsche
>  > > > lug nuts in polished stainless. At $7 each, they're cheaper
>  > > than the local
>  > >
>  > > > Porsche dealer, who wanted $10 apiece for the weaker (but
>  > > > lighter) alloy
>  > > > ones. Boothe Design can also provide matching locks.
>  > > >
>  > > > Moral of the story: order the 14x1.5mm studs in 40mm
>  length and
>  > > > hope your aftermarket wheels have cone seats. (you will need
>  > > ball seat nuts
>  > >
>  > > > for the stock wheels)
>  > > >
>  > > > Steve Powers
>  > > > 95.5 S6 Avant
>  > > >
>  > > > _______________________________________________
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>  > > > S-CAR-List at audifans.com
>  > > > http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/s-car-list
>  > > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >
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>  >
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