[s-cars] S-CAR-List Digest, Vol 22, Issue 9

Thu Aug 4 17:31:30 EDT 2005

On Thu, 04 Aug 2005 13:54:21 -0400, s-car-list-request at audifans.com wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
>
> 1.  centrifugal oil separator, CAD drawing. who said this? (brian
> hoeft)
> 2. Re:  Catch Can extended Candle theory does not apply (TODD
> KRAMER) 3. Re:  Gas mileage on your UrS? (George)
> 4. Re:  Catch Can extended Candle theory does not apply (Mark
> Strangways) 5.  Door molding (Robert Myers)
> 6. Re:  Catch Can extended Candle theory does not apply (jpb3) 7.
> Re:  Gas mileage on your UrS? (Taka Mizutani) 8. Re:  Catch Can
> extended Candle theory does not apply (djdawson2 at aol.com)
> 9.  Need P/N for generic Bosch O2 Sensor - ASAP (Douglas Fifield)
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
>
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 04:31:07 -0000
> From: "brian hoeft" <qbrian at ptd.net>
> Subject: [s-cars] centrifugal oil separator, CAD drawing. who said
> this? To: <s-car-list at audifans.com> Message-ID:
> <twig.1123129867.46095 at ptd.net>
>
> someone said this, but my email only stated it was from s-car-list..
>
>
> Guys, guys, guys, BTDT. These breather bottles don't work. You NEED
> a centrifugal oil separator. Air/oil goes in at an angle at the
> top, spins around in a double walled cylinder, oil drains back to
> the block and air goes out through a filter or into the exhaust.
> Trevor Frank built one for me. I have a CAD drawing. Anybody
> willing to step up on the manufacturing end????? Oh, btw, it works
> like champ. Lemme know bb
>
> i dont know you guys well enough to know who bb is, but hey bb!
> drop me a line, or send me the CAD drawing and id be happy to see
> what it would take in time&money to get it done, and report back to
> see if its still something more than myself would like to go for.  -
> brian
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 23:54:23 -0600
> From: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply To: s-car-list at audifans.com
> Message-ID: <BAY106-F15B59124E687CBCFB41804B9C40 at phx.gbl> Content-
> Type: text/plain; format=flowed
>
> In this debate, I think using the candle experiment is moot. A
> turbo motor, plumbed as the AAN is, will draw the crankcase under
> vacuum while under boost.
>
> The pressure created by the spooling turbo, as our crankcase
> breather hose plumbs directly into the intake path at a 90 degree,
> the rush of intake air will draw the vapors out of the valvecover.
> As the oil is swimming across the valvetrain and towards the
> breather hole ... some will get sucked in. Under high enough boost
> (say,during overboost for modified engines), I will go as far as
> saying, that a significant amount of oil will be sucked into the
> intake path. ... got the sludge to prove it.
>
>
> ________________________
> Todd E. Kramer
> '95 S6, far from stock
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:20:35 +0200
> From: "George" <g.grubr at connectel-us.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Gas mileage on your UrS?
> To: "'Joe Pizzimenti'" <joe.pizzimenti at gmail.com>,        "'Ivan
> Demkovitch'" <idemkovitch at hotmail.com> Cc: s-car-list at audifans.com
> Message-ID: <20050804092016.522893AFCD at shs001.connectel-us.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;        charset="us-ascii"
>
> Joe, I feel sorry for you - I was in Germany week ago and full tank
>  21 gallons (about 82 liters) of Super Plus on the autobahn was
> about $140+ .... not to mention the fuel mileage around 10 mpg
> .... damn, fuel in states is still cheap ....
>
> George
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com
> [mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com] On Behalf Of Joe
> Pizzimenti Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 16:40 To: Ivan
> Demkovitch Cc: s-car-list at audifans.com Subject: Re: [s-cars] Gas
> mileage on your UrS?
>
> 50 bucks is nothing!
> I think it's 85+ when I fill up the 32 gallon tank in the truck.
> Fun stuff.
>
>
> Gas mileage sounds fine to me.
>
>
> Joe
> 03 Evo (Pederson edition)
> 05 F-150 13mpg if I'm good
>
>
> On 8/3/05, Ivan Demkovitch <idemkovitch at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> After yesterday $50 fill up I became little worried :-) I get 15-
>> 16mpg city/highway driving. I get about 23-24 when driving on
>> cruise control at 80mph.
>>
>> Yes - I have heavy foot and everything. I compare to my 540i
>> which I drive on a same manner and even faster. I constantly get
>> 18-19mpg with same driving out of V8 4.4L motor..
>>
>> Is it ok gas mileage? Or something could be wrong? I had O2
>> sensor replaced recently with universal 3 wire sensor. I also
>> have Stage 1 chip
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Ivan
>> 93' S4
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> S-CAR-List mailing list
>> S-CAR-List at audifans.com
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>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 09:00:29 -0400
> From: "Mark Strangways" <Strangconst at rogers.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply To: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>,        "S-CAR at audifans.com"
> <S-CAR-List at audifans.com>
> Message-ID: <001801c598f4$8593df30$6400000a at Strangwaysgroup.ca>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> I don't think I can agree with you too much, sorry. I can't see a
> simple 90 degree entry point becoming a very good venturi.
>
> Mark
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>
> To: <s-car-list at audifans.com>
> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 1:54 AM
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply
>
>
>> In this debate, I think using the candle experiment is moot. A
>> turbo motor,
>> plumbed as the AAN is, will draw the crankcase under vacuum while
>> under boost.
>>
>> The pressure created by the spooling turbo, as our crankcase
>> breather hose plumbs directly into the intake path at a 90
>> degree, the rush of intake air
>> will draw the vapors out of the valvecover. As the oil is
>> swimming across the valvetrain and towards the breather hole ...
>> some will get sucked in. Under high enough boost (say,during
>> overboost for modified engines), I will
>> go as far as saying, that a significant amount of oil will be
>> sucked into the intake path. ... got the sludge to prove it.
>>
>>
>> ________________________
>> Todd E. Kramer
>> '95 S6, far from stock
>>
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now!
>> http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>
>
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> ------------
>
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 09:05:29 -0400
> From: Robert Myers <Bob at chips-ur-s.com>
> Subject: [s-cars] Door molding
> To: s-car list <s-car-list at audifans.com>
> Message-ID: <6.2.1.2.0.20050804090009.01f4fb10 at s-cars.org> Content-
> Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
>
> Hi Y'all,
>
>
> A few months ago someone, IIRC, put together a GP on the urS4/S6
> lower front door moldings.  Correct?  Well, at the time I wasn't
> needing the moldings so I idiotically didn't save the posts.  Duh.
>
> Could someone provide some source information for me?
>
>
> TIA
>
>
> Bob
> Http://Chips-Ur-S.com
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 10:42:27 -0400
> From: jpb3 <jpburns3 at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply To: "S-CAR at audifans.com" <S-CAR-List at audifans.com> Message-
> ID: <27b68a60508040742677459c3 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type:
> text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> Guys,
> The crankcase breather hose that dumps into the turbo intake cannot
> draw any oil from the valve cover as it is totally sealed from the
> valve cover!  There is an enclosed tube that runs through the valve
> cover.
>
> john
>
>
> On 8/4/05, Mark Strangways <Strangconst at rogers.com> wrote:
>
>> I don't think I can agree with you too much, sorry. I can't see a
>> simple 90 degree entry point becoming a very good venturi.
>>
>> Mark
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>
>> To: <s-car-list at audifans.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 1:54 AM
>> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
>> apply
>>
>>
>>> In this debate, I think using the candle experiment is moot. A
>>> turbo motor,
>>> plumbed as the AAN is, will draw the crankcase under vacuum
>>> while under boost.
>>>
>>> The pressure created by the spooling turbo, as our crankcase
>>> breather hose plumbs directly into the intake path at a 90
>>> degree, the rush of intake air
>>> will draw the vapors out of the valvecover. As the oil is
>>> swimming across the valvetrain and towards the breather hole
>>> ... some will get sucked in. Under high enough boost
>>> (say,during overboost for modified engines), I will
>>> go as far as saying, that a significant amount of oil will be
>>> sucked into the intake path. ... got the sludge to prove it.
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________
>>> Todd E. Kramer
>>> '95 S6, far from stock
>>>
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________ FREE
>>>  pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now!
>>> http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>> --------------
>>
>>
>>> _______________________________________________ S-CAR-List
>>> mailing list S-CAR-List at audifans.com
>>> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/s-car-list
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> S-CAR-List mailing list
>> S-CAR-List at audifans.com
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 11:57:37 -0400
> From: Taka Mizutani <t44tqtro at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Gas mileage on your UrS?
> To: s-car-list at audifans.com
> Message-ID: <79698a910508040857430824ca at mail.gmail.com> Content-
> Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> And buying gas in Japan in 1993, 91RON gas was about $100 for a
> tank. Gas has gotten more expensive since then.
>
> With that twin-turbo engine in the RS6 Plus, I'm surprised you
> can't see the gas gauge move when you're at full throttle on the
> autobahn.
>
>
> Taka
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2005 12:13:36 -0400
> From: djdawson2 at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply To: jpburns3 at gmail.com, S-CAR-List at audifans.com
> Message-ID: <8C767269AA34220-12E4-2344 at FWM-D37.sysops.aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Yep,
> The valve cover is not vented in any way, except through the
> crankcase.  Further... that hose that T's directly into the intake
> manifold only allows flow at idle (high vacuum) and closes off as
> soon as vacuum drops.  At that point, all ventilation flows through
> the intake of the turbo.
>
>
> Todd, the reason you have "the sludge to prove it" is because while
> the engine is under operation, oil vapors are continously flowing
> throughout the system... either directly through the intake
> manifold (idle), or through the turbo inlet (all the time except
> idle).  This oil vapor will condense as soon as it gets to
> something cooler... usually the X-over to IC hose... and inside the
> IC.
>
>
> Even if you go to a catch can, you're still not eliminating the IM
> path for recirculation. HTH, Dave
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jpb3 <jpburns3 at gmail.com>
> To: S-CAR at audifans.com <S-CAR-List at audifans.com>
> Sent: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 10:42:27 -0400
> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
> apply
>
>
> Guys,
> The crankcase breather hose that dumps into the turbo intake cannot
> draw any oil from the valve cover as it is totally sealed from the
> valve cover!  There is an enclosed tube that runs through the valve
> cover.
>
> john
>
>
> On 8/4/05, Mark Strangways <Strangconst at rogers.com> wrote:
>
>> I don't think I can agree with you too much, sorry. I can't see a
>> simple 90 degree entry point becoming a very good venturi.
>>
>> Mark
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "TODD KRAMER" <toddekramer at msn.com>
>> To: <s-car-list at audifans.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 1:54 AM
>> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Catch Can extended Candle theory does not
>> apply
>>
>>
>>> In this debate, I think using the candle experiment is moot. A
>>> turbo motor,
>>> plumbed as the AAN is, will draw the crankcase under vacuum
>>> while under boost.
>>>
>>> The pressure created by the spooling turbo, as our crankcase
>>> breather hose plumbs directly into the intake path at a 90
>>> degree, the rush of intake air
>>> will draw the vapors out of the valvecover. As the oil is
>>> swimming across the valvetrain and towards the breather hole
>>> ... some will get sucked in. Under high enough boost
>>> (say,during overboost for modified engines), I will
>>> go as far as saying, that a significant amount of oil will be
>>> sucked into the intake path. ... got the sludge to prove it.
>>>
>>>
>>> ________________________
>>> Todd E. Kramer
>>> '95 S6, far from stock
>>>
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________ FREE
>>>  pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get it now!
>>> http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>> --------------
>>
>>
>>> _______________________________________________ S-CAR-List
>>> mailing list S-CAR-List at audifans.com
>>> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/s-car-list
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> S-CAR-List mailing list
>> S-CAR-List at audifans.com
>> http://www.audifans.com/mailman/listinfo/s-car-list
>>
>>
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>
>
> ------------------------------
>
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2005 12:54:08 -0500
Greetings again from Utah!

Further work and diagnosis on the EVER SO FUSSY  92 S4 yields new information - THANKS to everyone who suggested things earlier!

Pulled the fuel rail and checked for spritzes while cranking, it does.  Have NOT done a pressure test on the system yet

Removed all rubber tubes for the intake system, cleaned the oily goop from inside them, also cleaned several oily and dusty boogers off the inside of the MAF, till its shiny and clean, reassembled the plumbing, no discernable leaks.

Spun the turbo shaft by hand, cannot detect any binding, however there is slight radial play when one wiggles the shaft side to side and up and down.. I dont know whats in tolerance, but it spins freely, even when cranking the engine in a no start situation.

NOW the car does this:  Starts and runs fine, for a minute or two, then begins a mild miss, which progressivly gets worse, until the car is just idling chunk chunk chunk chunk chunk, and finally dies.  It appears that high revving the engine, makes it happen sooner, however since it takes several hours chilling out, for me to repeat this, that data is sketchy...

Any thoughts from the hive would be lovely!!

Fuel filter(s) ?  
Cat Meltdown?
Heat...?

Thanks in advance
Ken
92 S4 *(garage denizen atm)
Ken at hartleys.net