[s-cars] Texas tea...oil, that is...

[Nathan Belo]

I now run M1 Truck/SUV available in 5qt jugs at Wal-Mart for $20.84.  Base oil is the same, but additive package is different from Delvac.  Can't go wrong with either, because they have the same HTHS, but i think delvac has more detergent properties for diesels.. it's the best diesel oil money can buy.  Here's a quote from an e-mail I sent to www.desmonorthwest.com (Ducati) when someone was asking about the 1.8T A4 vs. Jetta explaining the oil topic.

[QUOTE=belikeh20]I am a driving instructor for the ACNA/NW (Audi Club N.America/NW formerly Quattro Club, but VW/Audi N.America made us change the name to sound more inclusive plus they have ownership of the name), as well as PCA & have been a member of the Audi Club since 1994 (I've owned '84 GTI, '88 90Q & currently a '92 Audi S4- 1of 442 imported that year).  I just got back from a weekend driving a '02 Jetta 1.8T around the Willamette Valley with the ACNW "Fun Run/Winery Tour."   [COLOR=DarkRed]http://homepage.mac.com/belo/Moto/PhotoAlbum53.html
[/COLOR] 
I'm very familiar with the 1.8T engine.  I have a friend (Eliot Lim) with a '98 A4 1.8TQ (Q=quattro) with over 100K+ miles, chipped & with a gallon of Toluene [COLOR=DarkRed]http://www.elektro.com/~audi/audi/toluene.html[/COLOR] (At PR/SIR during a Porsche event I couldn't be passed by a RS America or any Porsche until my brakes started to catch on fire, so I had to pull off.  This stuff is like cocaine for your engine!  I was driving my pig of a sedan too.) in every tank since day 1 & every oil change was with synthetic oil.  I also have a friend with a '01 A4 1.8TQ, with every oil change using dino oil, getting a new engine under warranty.  1.8T is in the A4, Beetle, Jetta, & Golf.  Cars with 30K miles are having engines replaced due to non-certified oil being used & clogging with sludge.  What happens is the oil line gets clogged & then the oil light turns on.  People keep driving while the car is starved of oil & then KABOOM!  When the oil light on the 1.8T comes on, pull over & shut the thing off.  My girlfriend owns a '02 Jetta 1.8T & didn't believe me until I showed her my friend's e-mail.  She's due for her 60k, so I have to run "Engine Flush" in the Jetta before I switch it over to synthetic to clean all the sludge out.  The early 1.8T had a tensioner problem which was corrected later on, we're doing the timing belt on my gf's car & tensioner at the 60K even though the factory service doesn't require it for cheap insurance.

1.8T gum up because people put cheap oil inside, which gums up regardless of the 3K mile oil change.  University Audi was unaware of the new VW/Audi oil certifications & due to Eliot Lim's (formerly '90 V8Q & currently '96 993 Targa, '05 Golf TDI, '94 F-150) research they had to change the oil they were putting in the cars for service.  At first they thought he was full of shit & when they checked they pretty much shut up & made the change because they didn't want to be held liable for warranty work due to them putting in cheap-ass non-certified oil in all the cars that came in for service.  They didn't want to be responsible for warranty repairs due to wrong oil put in.  I just found out the Mobil 1 formula (Yes, Costco sells it) is not certified for turbos anymore so I'm now switching my car & my girlfriends '02 1.8T Jetta to Mobil 1 Truck/SUV oil.  It's available at Wal-Mart in 5qt. jugs for $20.

Audi/VW require 502.00 oil which is based on ACEA A3 which in turn is based on a key specification called HTHS (high temperature, high shear (rpms), arguably the only thing that really matters for a small high revving turbo engine.

ACEA A3 has a minimum HTHS requirement of 3.5. Mobil 1 0W-40 meets only the minimum requirement of 3.5 and loses viscosity as mileage accumulates.  It is the runt of the Mobil 1 litter and unfortunately carries
too many certifications!

The Mobil 1 SUV oil has not been VW certified nor ACEA certified presumably because it is not sold in Europe, but the HTHS rating is published and is an excellent 4.1, much better than the spec requires and much better than 0W-40. In fact the SUV oil is almost as good as the 15W-50 for high temperature protection and the 15W-50 has gone downhill over the years. Crappy brand oils will never reveal their HTHS rating.  And yes, Mobil 1 SUV oil has far more group V in it than the 0W-40 version or any of the other Mobil 1's.. Not everything within the same brand is equal... 

Group V is the ultra exotic stuff used in Redline.. You can get Redline levels of performance (well almost) without the price and with official certification by using Mobil 1 SUV 5W-40...  The 0W-40 is surprisingly lame for the brand.  The SUV oil doesn't have ACEA A3 certification because presumably they don't sell it in Europe, but the HTHS number of 4.1 comfortably exceeds the 3.5 requirement which really is what you are looking for anyway.
  
Even Redline & Amsoil (Amway-MLM oil) are not certified because they're too cheap to pay for certification.  Too bad Porsche "recommends" Mobil 1, because certain grades are not good enough for the turbos or normally aspirated cars because of the formula change, remember Audi/VW turbos are oil & water cooled & they get really hot which is why choice of synthetic oil is so important.   If you know your oils and you are armed with the HTHS number, the lack of certification is not a problem.

The problem with the 1.8Ts blowing up is really VW/Audi of America's fault for specifying inadequate oil.  They are not alone.. Lots of Toyotas and Lexii are also blowing up for the same reason.. It's not the engineers' fault, it is the accountants'.

Beware of some dealers (Auburn VW) charging $6/qt for "synthetic" when they only put in $2/qt Castrol semi-synthetic.. That is indeed a rip off, but bring your own is the best bet.  Jiffy lube "synthetic" may also be just as inadequate.  Subaru dealers also sell semi-synthetic as synthetic.

My car has 174K+ miles (driven hard on the track & chipped) & the 3rd timing belt was just put on with a new tensioner too.  Mobil 1 since 89K miles.  I still have some left over Mobil 1 & as soon as it's used up I'm switching to the Truck/SUV Mobil 1 (15-50W).  Blame the oil companies for being so cheap & changing the formulas.  Their profit is at an all-time high.  Too bad for the unaware consumer/non-car geek.

In a nut shell, the [COLOR=DarkRed]1.8T IS A FABULOUS ENGINE[/COLOR] if the maintenance was done & the right oil put in.  Not too much lag & torquey.  Just flush the engine out of all the cruddy oil & sludge & start using synthetic.  There are so many tuning options for this engine & many people know this engine since it has been around for about a decade in so many cars.[/QUOTE]



Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2005 20:38:17 -0400
From: LL - NY <larrycleung at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [s-cars] Texas tea...oil, that is...
To: Aaron Taylor <aaront at cox-internet.com>
Cc: s-car-list at audifans.com
Message-ID:
	<85e5c2670510241738l47f9f11dtb748cccc285be46 at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I've noticed that too (the lesser consumption of the lower viscosity oil, in
my case
M1 10W-30) in the UrS6. Anyone have any idea why this is?
 LL - NY

 On 10/24/05, Aaron Taylor <aaront at cox-internet.com> wrote:

>>
>> So do I
>> And - The motor consumes less of the 5/30 then the 15/50
>> Aaron
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com
>> [mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com] On Behalf Of Tony Curran
>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 5:25 PM
>> To: Jason Mawhinney; s-car-list at audifans.com
>> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Texas tea...oil, that is...
>>
>> I use mobil 1 15/50 in summer and 5/30 winter.
>>
>> Tony
>> 96 S6
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com
>> [mailto:s-car-list-bounces at audifans.com]On Behalf Of Jason Mawhinney
>> Sent: October 24, 2005 3:38 PM
>> To: s-car-list at audifans.com
>> Subject: Re: [s-cars] Texas tea...oil, that is...
>>
>>
>> Wow! This really could open this can of worms again! If you can't tell,
>> this subject has been beaten to death on this list but it seems that while
>> everyone groans about it, they always comment. Anyway, I use the big juggs
>> from Wally world. M1 15-50 Extended Performance is supposedly the one that
>> has the ratings for our cars. We also get down to the single digits and
>> less in the winter around here in Boone, NC but rarely get up to 90 in the
>> summer. This is all I run in my beasts and have not experienced any
>> problems.
>> HTH,
>> Jason Mawhinney
>> '95 S6 avant
>> '87 5ktq
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Eric Phillips" <gcmschemist at gmail.com>
>> To: <s-car-list at audifans.com>
>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2005 3:11 PM
>> Subject: [s-cars] Texas tea...oil, that is...
>>
>>
>  
>
>>> > Hey, S-Folks!
>>> > OK, so now that my trim strip adventure is over (not much of an
>>> > adventure -
>>> > took me all of about 10 minutes) I must think about changing this
>>    
>>
>> beast's
>  
>
>>> > oil soon. I have read a lot about oil, used to work in a refinery, and
>>> > have
>>> > used Mobil 1 full synth on all my VW/Audi cars for the last 15 years.
>>    
>>
>> But
>  
>
>>> > turbo cars are different. The guy that owned it previous to me used
>>    
>>
>> 15W50
>  
>
>>> > synth (no brand mentioned.) So, the question:
>>> > What brands of synth comply with the VW/Audi oil standard, and what
>>> > viscosity would be good for a place that gets up to 100 degrees in the
>>> > summer, and down in the single digits in winter? Any of my Spokane
>>> > brethren
>>> > reading? Bueller?
>>> > BTW, the local Wally World has 15W50 in big 5-quart jugs. And I like big
>>> > jugs.
>>> > Thanks, guys,
>>> > Eric.
>>