[s-cars] Cracked Big Brake Brackets - ECS Stage 2

[Taka Mizutani]

Some corrections, Eric:

-Porsche did not design the 993tt calipers, Brembo did.

-Porsche is far from having the deepest pockets in racing. Ferrari outspends
Porsche by
a huge margin just running the F1 program.

The other thing, which is not a correction, is that all aluminum is not the
same. I don't know why this is
not mentioned more often- there are tons of different alloys of aluminum, as
well as heat processes. You
most definitely cannot make an apples to apples comparison between even 6061
and 7075 aluminum, which
are two very common alloys. I am not a materials engineer, so I cannot
really expound much further, but
the alloy, heat treatment and method of manufacture are also very crucial
factors in determining durability
and proper application.

Having said that, I'm still very leery about aluminum control arms and other
suspension pieces. While you're
talking about brakes, if your front control arms snap, it doesn't matter how
well your brake brackets are engineered,
you're not going to be doing much braking. I know that an OEM will not
underengineer something that important
due to the financial risk they would be taking, but it still gives me
concern, having one or two cars with aluminum
suspension bits.

Taka


On 10/23/06, Eric Phillips <gcmschemist at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 10/23/06, Mark Strangways <StrangConst at rogers.com> wrote:
> > I suppose the same hold true for the Aluminum calipers, they are made of
> the
> > same materials you dislike, and also suffer from the same (if not worse)
> > stresses that are imposed on the brackets.
>
> Absolutely true.  Also designed by arguably the deepest-pocketed
> racecar maker in the world.  And made with quite a bit more material.
>
> With no reported breakage issues that I've ever heard of.
>
> > Ohh wait aluminum wheels too, send those as well.
> >
> > Eric, I have read your argument on the BIRA list, while I surely agree
> > Aluminum is not as strong as steel, I think it's adequate for the job at
> > hand. I will keep my brackets and hats, calipers and wheels.
>
> Aluminum, in the abstract, is appropriate in some applications (like I
> said.)  Its material strength is not my major concern.  Material
> properties are my concern.
>
> Hats?  No problem.  Wheels?  Same story.  Calipers could be argued.
>
> But none of the above have even the slightest mention of failure.  To
> extrapolate that ALL aluminum is bad in ALL automotive applications
> would be incorrect in light of my comments.  I don't think that, and I
> don't believe anyone thinks that's what I'm trying to say.
>
> Maybe some of the designs are adequate.  Which ones?  I don't know.  I
> think we can safely say that ECS doesn't provide one, yet.  As I said,
> the others may be perfectly adequate.  I have taken great pains to say
> that, in fact.
>
> If you feel comfortable with your choices, then what I'm saying
> doesn't matter in the least.  "Nothing to see here, folks - go back to
> your homes..."
>
> :)
>
> Eric
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