[V8] gearbox swap questions

[Scott Justusson]

You are lucky you don't work on Mercedes Tony!  I say a higher control module count ('modular electronics' build approach) allows better diagnostics and ultimately less expensive repairs.  The lower the module count, the higher the cost of multitasking modules vs a higher module count with less multitasking modules.

Auto v Manual.  It's all about DCT.  CVT can't handle the power levels, and Manual Transmissions are already a few gears behind, and are continuing to lose consumer flavor in the real world.  The manufacturers are all about transmission efficiency, fuel efficiency and warranty claims.  DCT addresses all three in a way that a fully automatic or a fully manual just can't.  As the number of DCT gears increases over the manual, the manual becomes *the* drag (pun intended) to those EPA numbers.  Never thought it would happen in my lifetime, but I suspect we are already effectively there.  

Tony, speak to Dupree on his DCT C2...  He's 5k miles into ownership, including track duty.  And as you know, he works all his vehicles as an enthusiast.  When we spoke on this exact topic, he shared that the number of times the DCT missed the mark is effectively zero.  Interesting too, the new Ferraris don't even offer a manual.  Blasphemy or our collective future from the folks that pioneered the early paddle shifters?

And CavalloGT is correct that 'torque' rules the planet in drivability.  More specifically to vehicle engineering, volumetric efficiency does.  You can attempt to widen VE on a specific engine (costly over a total engine group), or you can add gears and just attach  a more univeral transmission with module shift profiling, to any given powerplant. That is the ZF approach to the 8 and 9 speed transmissions they offer.

Cheers

Scott J
2 x HP24



 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Tony and Lillie <tonyandlillie1 at earthlink.net>
To: Professor GT gmail <CavalloGT at gmail.com>; V8 <V8 at audifans.com>
Sent: Mon, Jun 3, 2013 9:36 pm
Subject: Re: [V8] gearbox swap questions


We are a bit off subject here now, so I'll go ahead and add this. Auto vs 
manual in a german car?

All the justification I need is in the repair/replacement bills. I've 
replaced two manuals ever in all my years wrenching, tons of autos. MUCH 
higher failure rate. That, in itself, is justification enough for me.

Though, the V8 auto's are generally quite robust and do not stick to that 
generalization.

BTW, the last Phaeton I did a full scan on had 28 modules. A Q7 I just 
worked on had 34, though. Boggles the mind, my 4kq has one. I've never 
scanned any VAG product with more than 35, though I suspect some of the 
newer A8's have upwards of 45. I generally only see up to about 08's in the 
shop right now.

Tony
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Professor GT gmail" <CavalloGT at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [V8] gearbox swap questions

> Better fuel economy with a manual?
> NOT!
> Maybe years ago, but with today's electronic controls, automatics are far 
> superior.
>
> Vehicle Control? See previous response!
>
> Pulling power? That thing called a torque converter kicks a clutches ass 
> hands down every time! See previous response!
>
> Driver Comfort, and ease of operation?
> Do I even need to ask?
>
> And with all this in mind, when applied to larger vehicles the case is 
> even more compelling for automatics! Any trucker who buys a new vehicle 
> with a stick is just kidding himself! The ONLY reason a trucker would 
> prefer a stick is because of the Neanderthal effect. It has been proven 
> over and over, beyond a shadow of a doubt that an Allison automatic is far 
> superior to any manual or automated manual ever created.
>
> Okay, now that I got that off my chest and put those facts out there, 
> before you call me a hypocrite, let me say that I have my V8 5-speed for 
> the novelty and rarity factors, coupled with the fact that its just fun to 
> drive! That is at least until I hit traffic!
> Having an original factory V8 5-speed is cool, and to the automotive 
> purist represents the best that the Europeans had to offer in its class, 
> at the time.
> I spite of the traffic I have not grown tired of it, and view it as a 
> blessing for the long weekend commutes I've been doing since last 
> Fall...........but an automatic is in the wings to replace my 5-speed as a 
> daily driver so I can save the stick for special occasions!
>
> Now I feel much better that my rant is done! LOL 

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