[Vwdiesel] Gas/diesel prices

Sun May 25 21:38:00 PDT 2008

Nationalizing oil companies!?!?!  Surely, someone is attempting humour.

What is it about people's greed and envy that makes them become so dillusional?  6 years ago, posted prices for WTI were under $13.00 a bbl., and well-head prices for things such as Wyoming heavy sour were a wopping $1.50.   I don't remember any great whining from the oil industry for the government to bail them out, nor any great public outcry to ensure that this vital industry be supported in any way to ensure that the resource they were producing would continue to be extracted from higher cost fields.  I DO, however, remember the advent of a boom of gluttony and waste by consumers that saw every man-jack driving an hour or three to work alone in their SUV.  And now we sit back and wonder why the prices are so high (if you plot them with respect to time and corrected for inflation, neither fuel nor crude oil are particularly high right now).

Another thing worth remembering:  Governments ALREADY make FAR MORE money from the oil and refined product sales than Big Bad Big Oil EVER has or will make.  So, you honestly believe that government can run business more effectively than business?  Maybe you should take a look at the very seat of socialism in North America - Saskatchewan (where I just happen to live).  The Provincial Government did just what you suggest:  nationalized most utilities, the automobile insurance industry, most of the potash industry, some of the oil, gas and pipelines.  Now, much to your surprise, you might notice that we have some of the lowest prices for most of those voter-sensitive commodities delivered by utilities.  You might also find that the provincial budget carries massive deficits for financing the idiotic business plans, failed projects, operating losses, etc. required to get those same low prices.  You might also notice that no large company will EVER make a significant investment 
here without 100% government guarantee (we happen to have more resources per capita than pretty much any other place on the planet).  

Under those circumstances, you would expect some very strong economic growth since the all-know government stepped in to save the day.  Well, we have had the same population since the depression, when this long-term experiment with socialism began.  Our best export is an endless stream of well-educated and productive children.  Our legacy is that every useless tit stays behind.  During one of the brief interludes of so-called "coservative" government in the '80s, the nationalized part of the potash industry - that was losing a then massive $149,000/day (a lot in those days for one million people to swallow).  That company went on within 15 years from being a moribund, government screw-up to the largest integrated ferilizer company ON THE PLANET (PCS).  Is this your goal for the USA? (to become a bannana republic?)  Nationalize a major industry and your wish will come true.

As to the oil sands:  They lie under AB and SK, not so sure about reaching accross the 49th.  They now provide over 25% of Canada's TOTAL energy, and are strategically positioned to become a similar portion of our exports to US (if they aren't already).  The cost of production is now under $12.00/bbl using existing methods, but newer extraction technologies have significantly better environmental impact.  NONE of these things would have come as far as they are without Big Bad Big Oil and their foresight to pour billions into this industry for nearly 100 years before anyone made their first nickel of profit.  Do you think government has that kind of strategic vision and committment?

Finally, it will only be when energy prices reach something reasonably close to reality ($10US/gal & $200/bbl) that all of the alternative energy options can become economically viable.  BTW: look at the disaster in ag land use, chemical waste, soil damage, food price distortion from a certain idiotic government sticking their nose into the market for alternative fuels by supporting ethanol (about the most STUPID initiative I have seen in my long life).  Yeah, we really need these morons running business.

----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Krummell <tomcat5 at tomsvw.com>
Date: Sunday, May 25, 2008 5:33 pm
Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Gas/diesel prices

> Nationalizing oil is not the answer; removing some of the silliness
> surrounding drilling prohibitions would be a good start.  Oil 
> companiesdon't set the prices of crude--OPEC and speculators do.
> 
> Reopening existing oil platforms in the Santa Barbara channel is a 
> start.Pumping from capped wells in the Whittier Hills, Long Beach, 
> San Ardo, Taft
> and coastal areas would reduce demand on international sources.  
> RestrictingAlaskan crude to US consumption points is another 
> consideration.  Oil sands
> beneath Alberta and most of North Dakota are waiting, though the 
> technologyto recover petroleum relies on higher price points than 
> the  $20-$40 levels
> of the past.
> 
> Diesel in Roseville is in the $5.09 to $5.13 range.
> 
> Tom Krummell
> Roseville, CA
> ====================
> 
> On Sun, May 25, 2008 at 3:57 PM, William J Toensing 
> <toensing at wildblue.net>wrote:
> 
> > You think your prices are bad? Here in the Grass Valley/Nevada 
> City area,
> > the price of regular is well over $4.00 & diesel over $5.00. 
> This morning at
> > a Shell station I had to pay $4.199 for regular, the most I have 
> ever paid
> > for gas in my life! I think diesel was $5.279 but I didn't look 
> closely as I
> > was in a rush, late on my Model A Club outing. $42 to fill up a 
> Model A
> > Ford! I think this country (USA) should do like Mexico & 
> Venezuela have
> > done. Nationalize Big Oil, especially the oil wells in this 
> country. In
> > Venezuela I understand gas is selling for $0.42 cents a gallon! 
> I don't
> > recommend our government subside gas that way but sell it at the 
> prevailing> market & use the profits to subside cars that can get 
> over 50 MPG &
> > especially plug in hybrids. I have heard comments that gas will 
> hit $5 or $6
> > a gallon this summer & may climb in the near future to $12 a gallon!
> > So far, I haven't been able to locate any local restaurant that 
> will give
> > away WVO. They all tell me it is already spoken for. If any of 
> you out there
> > have a source of WVO, I suggest you start collecting all you can,
> > stockpiling it to make into biodiesel, or run as WVO.
> > _______________________________________________
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> >
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> The mockingbird can change its tune 37 times in 7 minutes. Politicians
> regard this ability with awe.
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