[Vwdiesel] Add just turbo to NA?

Sun Apr 1 08:11:43 PDT 2012

Not really.  The eco put a blower on to increase the air but did not 
substantially increase the HP and torque.  When the eco came out, I 
quickly grabbed a NA, not wanting the increased perceived maintenance
and complexity.  That was a poor decision on my part.

I have a 91 NA, and have considered what Doyt is contemplating.  The biggest 
factor in my not doing it is the benefit for the cost.  The second biggest 
factor is that the engine RPMs and the gearing were fine on the old Jetta
in the days when highway speeds were 55 or 60, but having recently run on 
several trips through the flatlands of Ohio and Indiana, the highway speeds 
are more like 75 even 80.  At those speeds the poor 1.6 is winding up real 
high and making tons of noise (which a turbo would help).

Adding air will help, and enlarging the exhaust up a size would be appropriate,
and combined there might be a 5% to 8% increase in fuel economy.

The EGT issues are driven by how much fuel is injected, and presumably with 
a blower, there would be no more injection than on the existing engine.  
A "leaner" burn will raise the temps, but is unlikely to cause a problem,
as the valves, cylinderhead and pistons tend to be fairly robust, and 
they are far from marginal in the NA engine.

Another factor is that you will probably want to run synthetic oil in the
engine.  On my 91, I do frequent oil changes, and synthetic would cramp 
my style.  The synthetic is necessary to avoid temperature polymerization
of the oil in the turbo bearing areas.  On the other hand, changing the 
oil filter is such a pain in the 91 that I would probably welcome less 
frequent changes.

All this said, I should disclose that I own a 99, 02 and 03 TDI, in addition
to the 91 IDI, and a gaggle of other diesel engines on various equipment.
While I find the 91 is the most comfortable, nicest starting and running 
car I own, the high engine RPMs at highway speeds has me buying TDIs for 
my kids, and shying away from the IDI engines.  That said, the around town 
mileage on the IDI is better than the TDIs and the trip mileage (highway
speeds) is better on the TDIs.

Again, my take is that it can't hurt, and a turbo has advantages, 
but the benefit may not be worthy of the expense and effort.

PS I have a friend who put a blower on a NA Ford 1910 tractor...about 2000 
hours ago, and reports no problems, except that his exhaust is much 
cleaner, and the tractor runs quieter. Last we talked about it, his compression
was fine, and as a result he has not pulled the head and has nothing to
report on valve condition. 

> 
> Isn't that basically the eco-diesel setup?
> 
> 
> On 3/30/2012 5:36 PM, Tad wrote:
> > I know I'm not the guy you asked to hear from, but what do you hope to
> > gain from adding air but not fuel?  I guess it will help burn fuel
> > more completely a little bit under otherwise-smoking conditions, but
> > the rest of the time it's just an obstruction in the exhaust, right?
> > All else being equal, adding air isn't going to help if you don't add
> > fuel too.
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 3:43 PM, Doyt W. Echelberger
> > <doyt at buckeye-express.com>  wrote:
> >> Has anyone added a turbo to a naturally-aspirated 5 speed 1.6 VW diesel from
> >> the 80's, without using special TD injectors and the TD injector pump that
> >> enriches under boost? I call this a partial conversion.
> >>
> >> Without a turbo, the car (89 Jetta 5 speed at 104k miles) seems to be
> >> working pretty hard between 45 and 70.
> >>
> >> I am looking for actual experience from people who have done a partial
> >> conversion (Rabbit or Jetta) and driven it for a few years.
> >>
> >> That's the main question. I know how to do the mechanical swap,  but would
> >> be interested in any unexpected problems you encountered in fitting the TD
> >> parts to the NA block and exhaust pipe.  But mainly I'm looking for how it
> >> ran after the conversion....at idle, at slow speeds around town, and at
> >> highway speeds 45-70 mph. (I would expect it to run about the same at idle
> >> and around town, and I _hope_ it runs easier on the straight and level
> >> between 45 mph and 70mph.
> >>
> >> I wonder if it might also run a little cooler and easier at highway
> >> speeds....and maybe get a little better fuel economy?
> >>
> >> If some of that isn't the case, I don't think I want to do the conversion.
> >>   I don't want to burn the valves and pistons in the process. So tell me if
> >> any of that bad stuff happened to you.
> >>
> >> After putting in the time and money to do the conversion, did the car run
> >> significantly better? I already have the conversion parts sitting on an 85
> >> Jetta TD that is headed for the scrap yard. All I need to do is pull the
> >> turbo and the manifolds and swap them onto the 89 na Jetta, along with the
> >> oil pan and the oil cooler adapter. I could also swap the TD injectors and
> >> the TD injector pump, but they both have 200k on them and probably need
> >> rebuilding. I know the TD pump leaks from the TD boost tower...about a drop
> >> per second.
> >>
> >> But if I add the TD injectors and a rebuild TD pump, the cylinder temps and
> >> exhaust gasses will probably run considerably hotter and I'll run the risk
> >> of melting a piston or burning a valve....and I can't easily swap in the
> >> factory TD oil squirters that cool the pistons.
> >>
> >> So, I'm looking for some advice from people who have been there and done
> >> that.  Loren already replied when someone ask the question in October of
> >> 2001, so I know I _can_ do it and it will run. Now I'm interested in HOW
> >> yours ran and what people learned from having done it.
> >>
> >> Doyt Echelberger
> >> Living in Ohio flat country at about 500 feet above sea level.....with
> >> diesel at $4.08 today.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
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> 
> 
> -- 
> 
>    Roger
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