[Vwdiesel] Still looking for brake line bleeding help on my bug

[Bryan Belman]

* For sure my brake switches are tight and clean, removed, checked and put them back in, so this bleed them as well.  no drips here after mess cleaned up.
 
* Good to know about the bottoming out will rip the rubber, that is only for old ones, not new master cylinders.
 
I do seem to get less flow on driver side port when I bleed it at the hard line connection to the Master, then passenger side. ??
As a test, I plugged the passenger side with an old brake line bent and soldered shut, brakes all worked fine, Left side driver was fine, no issues.
So figured it has to be something on that right side that I just plugged.  Removed drum, removed wheel cylinder to check rubber cups, look for any dirt, all is fine.  Replace rubber brake hose with good one, still nothing but froth and fluid for a little bit and then fluid flows fine and air will not stop, no brake shoe movement at all.
 
When does a VW guy concede to defeat !!!! ? !!!!  I just can't do it.
 

Bryan Belman, Pt. Pleasant, NJ
04 Jetta Wagon TDI PD BEW, 100hp, 5sp -- running :<)
04 Golf TDI PD BEW, 100hp, 5sp Tiptronic Auto -- running :<)
82 Diesel Westy 1.9NA 1Y -- running :<)
70 Type 1 Beetle -- Under Restoration forever:-)
On Tuesday, April 15, 2014 2:14 PM, "waterloo at sasktel.net" <waterloo at sasktel.net> wrote:
  
Are the brake light switches leaking maybe, sucking air internally?  
Your master cyl is new so bottoming out shouldn't be an issue.   What happens on an old one is the unworn cylinder past the usual travel can damage old rubber plungers if you bottom it out. A new one in that respect should be fine.   

If the fluid is foamed up to that extent, it is a master cylinder problem or air getting to that in some way to get frothed up.   ‎Fluid gets to the cylinder fine also, as in there are no restrictions from reservoir to the front side of the master cylinder?
Good luck
-james 

Sent by my thumbs
  Original Message  

From: Bryan Belman
Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2014 7:55 AM
To: Vw Fans
Reply To: Bryan Belman
Subject: [Vwdiesel] Still looking for brake line bleeding help on my bug

 OK, one last plea for help before I pay someone to figure it out.
I still can not get the front brakes to work on the bug.  Here is what I have done.

Removed front wheels and dis-assembled brake cylinders, looking for splits in boots, they are new (7 years ago), no issues found.
Replaced cheap china rubber brakes hoses with Meyle hoses, front and back.
Replace hard lines front and back with Meyle as after market lines I had would not stop leaking and I had to crush the nipple to try and get them to stop, that is why I junked them all and purchased all new, Meyle stuff, NO ISSUES with leaks now.
Adjusted, and re-adjusted brake shoes so they are dragging a good bit, to much to send the car out on the road, but fine for bleeding brakes to be sure they are out all the way.

I still suspect air MUST be getting in past the front cylinder in the brake master.
‎
Here is the mystery.
If I let the car sit, days, which it does, when I go out to bleed, rear brakes work fine.
They work fine all the time.
The, with front of car jacked up, before I touch the bleeders on right side (passenger), the brakes seem to work, again, this is after the car sits.
No drips of fluid anywhere.
as soon as I start to bleed this wheel, after 2 or 3 pump ups on the peddle from my wife, the fluid gets milkey colored with what I think is very small air bubbles.
Once I see this, by the 3rd time she pumps brakes 3 times and I open bleeder, lots of air comes out and the brakes stop working.
With the peddle up, if I open the bleeder and I have her push slowly to the floor to PUSH fluid out, when she is at bottom, I close the bleeder, this does not help either.
I have bleed a gallon of fluid through the system, bleed at the 3 ports on the master as well, nothing gets the fronts to work consistantly.


So, this brake master is acting the SAME way as the first one that was on the car, 7 years old, but new brake master.  
The 2nd one is from local auto parts store, KMM, paid way to much, but live and learn.

What would you all do next?
I have since put the first brake master in a coffee can of brake fluid and "bench bleed" it properly, it seem to work fine, no bubbles when in coffee can.
Should I swap that one back on?

Air is getting into the front brake system, that is obvious, but where.
I remember once that someone posted if you do not go very slowly and only 1/2 way down when first bleeding the master cylinder you can damage the insides of it, has anyone else heard this?



Thanks, again.

Bryan Belman, Pt. Pleasant, NJ
04 Jetta Wagon TDI PD BEW, 100hp, 5sp -- running :<)
04 Golf TDI PD BEW, 100hp, 5sp Tiptronic Auto -- running :<)
82 Diesel Westy 1.9NA 1Y -- running :<)
70 Type 1 Beetle -- Under Restoration forever:-)
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