[Vwdiesel] To warm
pmdolan1 at sasktel.net
pmdolan1 at sasktel.net
Tue Feb 11 05:15:41 PST 2014
We got the Stewart-Warner "South Wind" heaters in earlier days, and I
have to say they put out decent heat, but were not really that
reliable. What several of you may be old enough to remember is the
long struggle at VW to put combustion heaters into air cooled cars and
vans. The earliest attempt at factory installed Type II heaters (IIRC
S-W) were taken over by VW engineers, and by the time they finished
installing all of their "safety features" they were so unreliable they
were dropped. The batte then shifted back onto German soil. Around
1967, Webasto succeeded in selling a properly integrated in-duct heater
(located above the transaxle) for type I. What was really wrong with
the dealer-installed heaters is that they did not do anything about air
curculation without the engine making revs, and they did not dischangre
their heat strategically to such places that driver's might find useful
as the windscreen. So, the integrated heater was the right
answer...and was thoroughly embraced by VW engineering. When it was
experimental, I am told it was referred to as "the Webasto heater" by
some, who would be promptly corrected as "The VOLKSWAGEN" heater. I
can't remember if it the exact years any more. Don't think you could
get one in any '67s, but IIRC they were there in some '68s and '69s.
Well, guess what? Yup, so safe after VW got at it, it didn't run.
We replaced all of those with B2 (later BN2) Eberspacher heaters
installed under good will that worked, were dead reliable BUT no longer
used the ductwork. If you called it "the Volkswagen Heater" you would
be scowled at. VWC guys called it the "Wee Bastard Heater".
The Type IIs finally got BN4 Eiberspachers, and they worked very well
(only one I ever found that was a real bugger had been in for several
warranty claims until someone finally gave me the van and said "fix it
- whatever it takes". Nobody had bothered to do the basic diagnosis -
and there just wasn't any airflow through the combustion chamber. I
started taking things apart and concluded that the perfectly shaped,
dent free, brand new exhaust pipe did not flow enough air. When I
probed it with a piece of welding rod (back when people actually welded
with bare steel - when we ran out of coat hangars) I could feel
something soft inside. A hook pulled out some line worker's lunch
bag, carefully put where it would be very difficult to find mid-way in
the pipe. Just in case you thought only the Chevrolet Vega plant at
Lordstown was the only example of union worker sabotage - we had it too
(but very rarely).
In the end, of course, VW (and Porsche) integrated the later BN series
heaters into the ductwork of Type II and IV - WHERE THEY SHOULD HAVE
BEEN FROM DAY ONE - and provided electric fans to boost flow - AS THEY
SHOULD HAVE FROM DAY ONE and had a heating system. I love my VWs, but
I can not make excuses for some of the incredible blunders that pure
arrogance perpetuated on the designs by the designers. I just wish
our MkIV was as good as our Type IV was in that department.
On Mon, 10 Feb 2014 21:42:21 -0800, Brian Decker <decker at toledotel.com> wrote:
Hi Loren; My big brother had a factory gas heater in his 1960 Corvair
> station wagon in California and it worked well. I had a South-Wind gas
> heater in my 1937 Buick Special coupe and it was great even in a Western New
> York winter.
> Brian Decker
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vwdiesel-bounces at vwfans.com [mailto:vwdiesel-bounces at vwfans.com] On
> Behalf Of lbaird119 at aol.com
> Sent: Monday, February 10, 2014 9:15 PM
> To: vwdiesel at vwfans.com
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] To warm
>
>
> Dad had a gas heater in his '56 Beetle. VW didn't offer one but Chevy did
> so he bought it new and installed it. Had to put a 12V battery in the trunk
> to run it. Kept the car toasty, thermostatically controlled. We still have
> the heater. Put exhaust heat recovery on it and it'd double the heat
> output!
> Loren
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Arkady Mirvis <arkadymirvis at gmail.com>
> To: Andrew .Libby <libbybapa at gmail.com>; LBaird119 at aol.com
> <lbaird119 at aol.com>
> Cc: vwfans vwdiesel <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Mon, Feb 10, 2014 2:27 pm
> Subject: To warm
>
>
> Once Eberspaecher air heater, emitting 16,000 BTU/HR, was installed in, cold
> e this in Beetle or bus, and Vanagon air or water, cold was a
> history. perated by timer the heater pre-warmed the vehicle and by
> thus guaranteed
> omfort in the severest frost. I also did installation of engine - cab eaters
> in large 18-wheelers tractor trailers. These 5 Kilowatts heaters ould
> preheat large diesel to 158 deg.F in 30 minutes. One needed to turn actory
> installed heater ( standard ) for cab heating and Eberspaecher would rovide
> a heaven. Once preset temp was reached the heater would go into alf-mode.
> Gasoline or diesel burning heaters are very safe and economical evices.
> ot that difficult to install.
> uestions are welcome. Ark Mirvis
>
> ----Original Message-----
> rom: Andrew .Libby
> ent: Monday, February 10, 2014 4:26 PM
> o: LBaird119 at aol.com
> c: vwfans vwdiesel
> ubject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Too cold
> I had a '69 beetle a little over 20 years ago. It would melt you out of he
> car if you were driving on the freeway and then you'd freeze when you ame to
> a stop and idled and the hot air was no longer being pushed orward... The
> last air-cooled vanagon I owned was very similar. My '74 us never had good
> heat, but the heater boxes and tube to the front was otted.
>
> n Mon, Feb 10, 2014 at 12:51 AM, <lbaird119 at aol.com> wrote:
> >
> Machinist I had one time, was laughing at the fogged up Type 1 that went
> by the shop one day. Local, foreign parts house owner had recently told me
> that if you seal everything up good, they had GOOD heat. Scot then
> proceeded to say "yeah, if you build a fire!" I said Dave also claimed
> that a bus had ok heat and was really comfy if you hung a blanket across,
> behind the front seats. Scott then added, a bus WOULD indeed have good
> heat if you built TWO fires! One in front and one in back!
> My work van got uncomfortable once it hit the 20's so I used that advice
> and would staple a pad wrapper (sheet of plastic) behind the front seat
> area. Made a HUGE difference between being cold and fairly comfy. (high
> performance 350 engine).
> Loren
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Hansen <jhsg at sasktel.net>
> To: lbaird119 <lbaird119 at aol.com>; vwdiesel <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Sun, Feb 9, 2014 3:14 pm
> Subject: RE: [Vwdiesel] Too cold
>
>
> Heck, I drove a 73 bus all winter one year when I was much younger. Now
> hat was a skimobile. There was enough heat just off the manifolds for up
> o -20C. After that, if you pulled onto the highway and got up to speed,
> he heat loss out the front was so impressively fast, you could feel a
> reeze generated by the convection. Buddy and I used to laugh about the
> hermal black hole it had on the front that operated at highway speed. In
> he city, I bet it was warmer than most cars, even without the aux heater.
> james
>
>
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