[s-cars] Front Suspension clunking (still)
Lee Levitt
lee at wheelman.com
Thu Sep 8 13:05:46 EDT 2005
I had a clunk on my '02 A6. Turned out to be a bad tie rod end.
Shop finally localized and diagnosed it by putting the car on an
alignment rack, exercising the steering and listening with a
stethoscope...
Lee
On Thu Sep 08 09:59:38 PDT 2005, matt ludwig
<matt.ludwig2 at verizon.net> wrote:
> I have the exact same front end cluck (left front) on my avant as
> Serge describes and have messed with it to no end as well. Has
> H&Rs w/ Bilstein's w/ original camber plates (not Igor mod'd)
> and has original control arms and bushings. Those were my first
> guess but upon complete removal/ inspection by my trusted
> mechanic, these were in great shape to him and when reinstalled,
> very tight and no play when pried. Also had the top nuts of
> struts on cambers tourqued and replaced the cambers w/ new OEM
> versions and still clucking there. My thought is that the
> Bilsteins are noisy and may be moving in the tube as Serge
> describes. Again, only a guess.
>
> matt ludwig.
> Lima, Peru
>
>
> On Sep 8, 2005, at 11:19 AM, Serge Filanovsky wrote:
>
>> Steve,
>>
>> FWIW I have also been struggling with the dreaded front end
>> cluncking though
>> I think my case is more extreme. Slow speed pavement
>> irregularities (of
>> which there are plenty on my local Brooklyn "roads") make so
>> much noise that
>> the car sounds and feels like an old beat up taxi. This started
>> happening
>> after Bilstein/Eibach/2B camber plate install a few months back.
>> Interestingly, the Bilsteins were installed first with stock
>> springs (don't
>> ask) and though I only drove the car less that 100 miles, I
>> heard no noises
>> (other than the axle bolt that, ahhemm... Bell Audi...Rahway,
>> NJ ... failed
>> to torque down properly). I had my regular mechanic install the
>> Eibachs and
>> the 2B plates. Thats when the noises really started.
>>
>> At first I thought it was the plate (only one side seemed to
>> make noise).
>> Indeed, the spherical bearing was loose in the black slider
>> housing, it was
>> not seated firmly against the large circlip (about 1mm of
>> movement, my
>> unmeasured guesstimate). 2B sent a replacement, it did not solve
>> the
>> problem, Ken said to torque down on the top strut mount nut (44
>> lb/ ft) which
>> I did, no help.
>>
>> Talking to folks at S//Fest I now suspect the inserts are
>> flopping around
>> inside the housing tubes. Thanks again, Bell Audi, I will be
>> ripping the
>> whole mess apart, as soon as I can find a place to do it.
>> Side-of- street
>> garage has been deemed inadequate for this chore.
>>
>>
>> Serge Filanovsky
>>
>> 95.5 S6 cluncky Avant
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> Steve clunked:
>>>
>>> <<<Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 16:23:36 -0700
>>> From: "Steve Voit" <stevevoit at comcast.net>
>>> Subject: [s-cars] Front Suspension clunking (still)
>>>
>>> I have worsening front end noise on which I'd like your opinion:
>>>
>>> * Distinct noise (metallic-ish creak or clunk) (right or left
>>> side, or
>>> both sides) principally when changing direction such as backing
>>> from
>>> drive
>>> and then proceeding forward. Most stop signs. Sometimes
>>> simply when
>>> braking and accelerating. Or the crown jewel: backing and
>>> turning from
>>> a
>>> parking spot in a hilly parking lot.
>>> * I had the 2 Bennett camber plates installed along with
>>> Eibach/Bilstein about 7000 miles ago, and drive smooth roads.
>>> * After first hearing the noise I had my control arms replaced
>>> * More recently 4000 miles later I replaced my sway bar
>>> bushings
>>> and
>>> tightened up all subfame mounts.
>>> * My sense is that it is lighter (lower mass) components
>>> that are
>>> causing the noise, and that the subframe stuff is not causal.
>>>
>>> Theories:
>>>
>>> 1. Fenders liners not adequately trimmed. This was 2Bennett's
>>> first
>>> reaction, I'll check this although I have reservations because
>>> the noise
>>> can
>>> equally occur during very quiet periods, suspension-wise, such
>>> as just
>>> turning in a parking garage at creeping speeds, where I
>>> wouldn't expect
>>> suspension deflection.
>>> 2. Inadequate torque on strut inserts. (favorite theory)
>>> 2Bennett
>>> suggest its difficult to achieve the 175-200 lb-ft torque on
>>> the strut
>>> collar. They have seen (only once) the lower part of the strut
>>> inserts
>>> make
>>> noise under this condition. Suggested that I tighten and/or
>>> machine a
>>> spacer collar for the strut. This dimensional situation was
>>> worse on
>>> older
>>> cars such as 4000's where the diameter of the insert was very
>>> much
>>> different
>>> from the strut housing.
>>> 3. Play in metallic ball on Camber Plate. 2Bennett suggests
>>> the
>>> plate
>>> was designed to be silent. My mechanic doesn't think he's
>>> observing
>>> enough
>>> motion at this location to make the noise.
>>> 4. I recall listers commenting on noise resulting from an
>>> interference
>>> b/w the sway bar and the conduit pipe that carries wiring
>>> across (under)
>>> the
>>> engine. I don't have information on this.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Any thoughts? I want to check everything out as long as I'm
>>> spending
>>> the $$
>>> to have a look.
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance,
>>>
>>> Steve in Seattle
>>>
>>> 95.5 S6>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Steve-
>>>
>>> Damn that saga sounds familiar, and has been kicked around on
>>> list for
>>> while now with seemingly no tangible conclusions. My case is
>>> same as
>>> yours minus camber plates. I even had the strut top mounts and
>>> bearings
>>> done. All I know is it is better now, something I did (likely
>>> the
>>> latter) got rid of it. Mostly. Bilsteins are tight as are
>>> their caps,
>>> heck I even added oil down the housings when we did the install
>>> to aid
>>> in internal strut dampening in the housing.
>>>
>>> Still sounds like crap up there. Sometimes. Which is the best
>>> part...
>>> it's all intermittent. Bill Perron and Iiken this wonderful
>>> phenomena
>>> to feeling like the entire front end is about to fall off. And
>>> then it
>>> feels good again.
>>>
>>> I still get that 'creek' when I return the wheel from right
>>> turns to
>>> center but that's not a clunk, speculation was like you said on
>>> that
>>> metal wiring conduit that runs across back of pan / sway bar.
>>> I pried
>>> on it to create distance, still creeky. Sounds great in my
>>> parking
>>> garage oh yes...
>>>
>>> My conclusion is like Serge aptly said, "sometimes my car
>>> starts to feel
>>> all used up" (Serge, trademark). Then on somedays it's fine.
>>> I just
>>> beat on it harder and it seems to help.
>>>
>>> Or something.
>>>
>>> HTH. Or doesn't. Not sure.
>>>
>>> -Paul
>>>
>>> ps. wonder if I should address that torn rack boot before I cook
>>> something else up there, naaaaaaa maybe it'll heal...
>>>
>>>
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>>
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