[s-cars] UrS teardown question

[Lee Levitt]

On Fri Oct 26 13:13:44 PDT 2007, Taka Mizutani 
<t44tqtro at gmail.com> wrote:

> Lee-
> In STX, you're down 57hp on the WRX and 100hp on the Evo- boost 
> mods are not
> allowed.

Hmm. My reading of the regs allows chips but not turbo exchanges. 
And I tend to get lumped in with some pretty serious hardware as 
we're all afterthoughts at both Porsche and BMW club events.

At my first event in September, there were 3 cars, a purpose built 
open wheel job, a built Mitsu with coilovers, big R compounds, 
horsepower, and me!

> 
> You can't run R compound tires in STX, so I hope you didn't just 
> make a very
> expensive mistake.

Tires cost me $200 for the 4, had 1 day on them. Not too expensive 
a mistake, if it was one.  I also thought that STX allows R 
compound.

> 
> Best tires for STX would be Falken RT-615, Bridgestone RE-01R- 
> the Hankook
> Z212 RS2, BFG KD and Kumho MX are further behind.

I'm on the BFG tires now. Pretty good, but I need more grip (well, 
actually, I need better form...)

> 
> I'd think you need at least H&R race coilovers and big sway bars 
> to get that
> A4 in shape. With enough drop, you can get a fair bit of camber.
> 

I'm running Eibachs, Bilsteins and HSport bars. I also understand 
that the VW/Audi suspension doesn't really like to be lowered too 
much (see Dick Shine Racing website for discussion).

> I don't know where you got those weight numbers- B5 A4s are a 
> wash with WRXs
> and Evos- they weigh nearly the same, all about 3250-3300lbs.
> 

Talking out my nose on that one, I ASSumed that the other cars 
were lighter...


> Evo school is generally regarded as a very good way to get a good 
> start in
> autox w/o picking up a ton of bad habits. You might have to wait 
> until next
> year to go to a school up in your area- season is pretty much 
> over now,
> isn't it?

Yes. There's a Test and Tune tomorrow at Devens, but it's going to 
be raining most of the day and I've got too much to do...I did an 
Evo school in my urS6 a few years ago, will do another one in the 
spring.

I also just signed up for the winter driving school, but that's a 
different topic. And I'm not sure what car I'll drive...the C5 A6 
or the B5 A4. I was not planning on putting winter tires on the 
A4...so I guess it will be the A6. My winter wheels won't fit over 
the Porsche brakes...

Lee

> 
> 
> Taka
> 
> 
> On 10/26/07, Lee Levitt <lee at wheelman.com> wrote:
>> 
>> One issue that I had with autocrossing my S6 is that I found the
>> steering to be somewhat slow at times...literally the PS pump
>> wasn't keeping up with input from the helm.
>> 
>> I have not noticed this in the '01 A4. The B5 A4 is a nice
>> platform for autocrossing. Also slow and uncompetitive, but fun.
>> I'm in STX with Subies and Mitsus, both of which kick my ass
>> bigtime. Funny what +500 lbs and -150 horses will do for
>> competitiveness.
>> 
>> I just picked up a set of R compound tires yesterday. We'll see 
>> if
>> those help the cause at all...the street tires seem to do a lot 
>> of
>> sliding and I'm really slow through the slaloms.
>> 
>> All of this, of course, is due to bad form, and more $ and parts
>> aint going to do much for that!
>> 
>> Lee
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Fri Oct 26 09:43:33 PDT 2007, rshydo at ithacamechanical.com
>> wrote:
>> 
>> > Oh man, I knew I was opening a can of worms.  Yes, I'm "That
>> > Crazy Guy"
>> >
>> > First off - Cody
>> >
>> > I've been watching your project for years.  Awesome work.
>> >
>> > Now - Joe and everyone who is thinking the same thing
>> >
>> > I've looked at NASA, but as a tech inspector for the SCCA, I'm
>> > already at
>> > all their events.  Might not be the fastest car out the first 
>> few
>> > seasons
>> > but since I'm already there.....  Will be book'ing the car as 
>> ITE
>> > (catch
>> > all street tires) or SPO (catch all slicks) pending some design
>> > choices. As both are regional only classes (no national points)
>> > its me against
>> > whoever shows up to the new england region events.  I'm just
>> > hoping it
>> > rains a lot during racing season!
>> >
>> > Yes, the S-cars "were" fat and heavy.  Lets just say that right
>> > now I'm at
>> > a little over 3100 lbs still with power windows, sunroof, 
>> factory
>> > glass,
>> > street wheels, factory body panels, and no removal of any
>> > sheetmetal.  My
>> > control arm/swaybar setup in the front will lose ~30 lbs
>> > including brake
>> > replacement.  Moving the rear suspension inboard will be dead
>> > even with
>> > weight unless I decide to make new rear upright assemblies (the
>> > stock ones
>> > weigh a ton).
>> >
>> > So I guess my answer (other than I know I'm nuts) is the S-cars
>> > were far
>> > too heavy/slow as audi delivered them.  But as a starting point
>> > for AWD,
>> > turbo, and pretty darn nice looking body its ok.  I'm hoping to
>> > be about
>> > 3000 lbs with the cage installed, so not great, but not bad.  
>> As
>> > far as
>> > too old, the 01E transmission (yes I have lots of spares) can 
>> now
>> > be
>> > adapted to any of the 10V/20V Audi engines, Audi V-8's, and VW
>> > VR-6's (and
>> > derivatives).  In a racing sense, old is good, as parts get
>> > cheaper.
>> >
>> > Rob
>> >
>> >
>> >> Joe's point is a good one too, but NASA that I suggested
>> >> classifies by
>> >> power to weight ratio (with modifiers for cars with slicks and
>> >> cars
>> >> with AWD), so the actual weight of the car is much less of a
>> >> concern
>> >> since we all know the AAN can easily make up for it.
>> >>
>> >> -Cody
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Quoting Joe Pizzimenti <joe.pizzimenti at gmail.com>:
>> >>
>> >>> I honestly hope that this "SCCA club racing rig" is the S-car
>> >>> towing
>> >>> your
>> >>> racecar.
>> >>>
>> >>> The easiest way to get into racing is to buy someone's 
>> prepped
>> >>> car that
>> >>> they
>> >>> gave up on.  Well, that's the cheapest anyway.  The S-car's 
>> too
>> >>> heavy &
>> >>> too
>> >>> old to be competitive now in SCCA.
>> >>>
>> >>> Joe
>> >>>
>> >
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>> >
>> >
>> 
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