[Vwdiesel] Rebuilt IP / Engine Won't Start

William A. Thompson toogreek at gmail.com
Sun Sep 21 14:40:32 PDT 2008 

Seems as though my gmail.com address is not
posting to the list so I switched the subscription
to my primary address to see if my posts will come
up on list. That is why I sent my suggestion
directly to you Bill. We'll see if my primary
address is allowed to post up as I am addressing
this to both you in back channel and to the list.

Off the top of my head I would have to say that
either you have a clogged fuel line/filter issue
or your "rebuilt" injection pump. If fuel is
available thru the stop solenoid at a normal flow
rate then if plenty of fuel is available to and
thru the pump it should respond to the accelerator
normally.

I'd have to think about it .... and there are
others who are more knowledgeable and who might be
better sources for the pickin' of the brain ....
but it seems to me that the ".... I have to back
the idle adjust screw all the way out to get the
engine to run at all ...." is the major clue here.

Have you ever had a dirty/contaminated fuel issue
where something might now be clogging the fuel
system badly enough that it will only get enough
fuel to the injectors for idling?

Before or after you installed this rebuilt pump on
this car .... was it ever a known to be good
runner since being rebuilt?

What were the reasons that you replaced the pump
in the first place?

Although it could still be a fuel supply
restriction problem up to and including the inlet
banjo connection to the pump .... I mostly suspect
the pump.

Do you have another pump to try out?

    ... Bill


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "William Longyard" <longyard at ix.netcom.com>
To: "William A. Thompson" <toogreek at gmail.com>;
<vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 1:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Rebuilt IP / Engine Won't
Start


> Bill,
>
> Wow!  I de-gutted the solenoid and the engine
fires right up, and runs
> smoothly now.  Sounds like it should.  As it
idled, I purged the injectors
> again, so I know there is no air in there.
>
> HOWEVER!!!!!!!!!   I still cannot get it to
accelerate.  The INSTANT I move
> the throttle, the engine dies.  I've tried this
from the engine bay itself
> with my hands.  If I just BARELY touch the
throttle, the engines immediately
> cuts off.
>
> Also, I have to back the idle adjust screw all
the way out to get the engine
> to run at all.
>
> Help!
>
> Bill L.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "William A. Thompson" <toogreek at gmail.com>
> To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 2:40 PM
> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Rebuilt IP / Engine
Won't Start
>
>
> > If indeed the fuel system is purged of air and
> > bubbles all the way from the tank to the
injectors
> > ....
> >
> > Take the guts out of the fuel stop solenoid
and
> > see if it runs above idle and under load.
> >
> > A few years ago the progression of one of my
> > Rabbits problems started out by running fine
but
> > every once in awhile it would shut down just
like
> > turning off the key .... usually under very
heavy
> > load while climbing one of our western
mountains.
> > Progressed to shutting down under relatively
light
> > load. Then started shutting down as you wound
it
> > up thru the gears on flat ground always
seeming to
> > shut down at about the same RPM regardless of
> > gear. Soon I couldn't get out of first without
it
> > bucking violently and then shutting down or I
> > would shut it down because of the bucking. Got
to
> > the point of starting up fine but "as soon as
I
> > give it any throttle it dies immediately" like
> > yours. All the while it would fire up
immediately
> > afterwards.
> >
> > The whole time the stop solenoid would click
> > appropriately when energized and after it died
I
> > could hear the solenoid click when
de-energizing
> > it afterwards.
> >
> > Finally in desperation I gutted the solenoid
of
> > it's seat and spring .... fired it up .... and
it
> > ran thru the gears fine at any RPM and load.
Of
> > course shutting it down required letting the
> > clutch out abruptly while in gear. New stop
> > solenoid and it's been running fine ever
since.
> >
> > I surmised that at first .... the solenoid was
> > opening but when the flow of fuel became high
> > enough a weakened magnetic field of the
solenoid
> > coil was overcome by the venturi effect of
fuel
> > going by it .... or something to that effect
....
> > causing the seat to close and shut off the
fuel.
> >
> > Try gutting the solenoid of it's seat and
spring
> > so it can not close off fuel and put it back
in
> > with only the coil which is housed in the
thread
> > body. Fire it up and see how she runs.
> >
> >    ... Bill
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "William Longyard"
<longyard at ix.netcom.com>
> > To: <brian at gochnauer.net>;
<vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 8:04 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Rebuilt IP / Engine
Won't
> > Start
> >
> >
> >> Hi Brian,
> >> I don't think the problem is the cylinders, I
> > think it is the IP.  I say
> >> this because I can get the engine to idle,
but
> > as soon as I give it ANY
> >> throttle, it dies immediately.
> >>
> >> Bill
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- 
> >> From: "brian gochnauer" <brian at gochnauer.net>
> >> To: <vwdiesel at vwfans.com>
> >> Sent: Sunday, September 21, 2008 10:37 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [Vwdiesel] Rebuilt IP / Engine
> > Won't Start
> >>
> >>
> >> > I've rebuilt hundreds of Caterpillar
diesels
> > and have often had to ream
> >> > the
> >> > ridge to get the piston out, but would
never
> > use a cylinder (liner) that
> >> > had
> >> > a ridge in it. I've never rebuilt a VW
diesel,
> > but have heard this reaming
> >> > honing and puting new pistons and rings in
the
> > bore on forums many times.
> >> > I find it hard to believe that this can be
a
> > good practice, I'd say that a
> >> > ridge would be at least .020 to bore size
and
> > is VERY hard to accurately
> >> > measure because of the slope of the ridge.
> >> >
> >> > William,
> >> > If you measured the bore after completely
> > removing the ridge, what was the
> >> > bore size.?
> >> >
> >> > I'd say leaving any ridge in the bore is
going
> > to be a problem because the
> >> > new piston and ring could constantly
> > 'slapping' that ridge and break the
> >> > piston ring. Honing is only going to make
the
> > bore bigger. Fitting the
> >> > ring
> >> > (gap) in the bore is going to be far from
good
> > considering the taper.
> >> > Although a crank speeds the rings may
expand
> > fast enough to keep a seal
> >> > against the cylinder wall at higher speeds
> > that is going to more
> >> > difficult.
> >> > Of course that explains why I hear about
> > people re-ringing the engine
> >> > every
> >> > 50k miles, to keep it running.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > On Sat, Sep 20, 2008 at 10:09 PM, William
> > Longyard
> >> > <longyard at ix.netcom.com>wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> I've got a rebuilt IP pump that I just put
on
> > my rebuilt engine.  I'm
> >> >> having
> >> >> trouble starting it.
> >> >>
> >> >> I used new turbo piston in my 1600NA
engine,
> > and I ridge-reamed and honed
> >> >> before installing them.  Ring gaps are to
> > specs.
> >> >>
> >> >> My compression from 1-4 is: 380, 385, 380,
> > 375psi.
> >> >>
> >> >> I believe this compression is low, but
know
> > that the rings haven't seated
> >> >> yet, and those are figures for a stone
cold
> > engine.
> >> >>
> >> >> When I crank over the engine for a long
time
> > it ALMOST wants to run, and
> >> >> a
> >> >> couple of times I have been able to get it
to
> > run for a few seconds.  I
> >> >> found that by backing the idle screw all
the
> > way OUT, it seems to want to
> >> >> run a little bit more.
> >> >>
> >> >> However, if I step on the throttle it dies
> > immediately.  Is the governor
> >> >> set
> >> >> wrong?  How do I set the governor?
> >> >>
> >> >> Other ideas?
> >> >>
> >> >> Thanks,
> >> >> Bill Longyard
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >
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> >> >>
> >
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> >> >>
> >> >
> >
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> >> >
> >
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> >>
> >>
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> >>
> >
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