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quattro-digest Friday, 24 January 1997 Volume 04 : Number 157
*
* Welcome to the digest version of the quattro list.
* See the end of the digest for unsubscribe info.
* In this issue:
RE: V8 quattro, 200 quattro, 90 quattro, quattro coupe
RE:4Q bumper lights
re: ice auto-x
Re: Oil Stuff
RE: Volvo AWD (Was: What are my choices?)
Re: Corroded Words??
Re: Dead Horses (shoot 'em again)
F/S S6 Parts list
F/S Parts QTC&5KT
NEED S6 WHEELS
'89 80 Quattro Purchase
Re: Steering Wheel Squeak
Re: Garage/Mechanic recommendation
Re: Light Research
lets all talk audi
Volvo AWD (Was: What are my choices?)
Thermostat Information
(Fwd) APPLE HILL, a success
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Nick Deutsch <deutscn@operatns.mohawkc.on.ca>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 15:24:32 -0500 (EST)
Subject: RE: V8 quattro, 200 quattro, 90 quattro, quattro coupe
Yes Ian, You couldn`t have said it better! I own a 90 20 valve (1990) and
of course I immediately recognized all the symptoms. Maybe I am lucky, so
far I only dealt with the "bomb" and dead air condition unit, although I
think another weak spot -at least on my car- are the brakes: had to have
the rotors changed 2 years ago and now they are acting up again
(vibrating), but I just live with it, because the rotors are SO
expensive. Yes, I also experienced the muffler/donut situation...
But all in all, the car is a blast, recently in Vermont my car was the
only one able to move after a big snow storm...
Nick Deutsch
------------------------------
From: MSV96@aol.com
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 16:01:14 -0500 (EST)
Subject: RE:4Q bumper lights
In a note dated 1/23/97 Duano asks;
>1. Reflectors in the bumper of the '85 - '87 4Qs . . .
>2. Has anyone found out what the Europeans put there instead?
>3. If so, how can I get 'em?
Years ago when I owned my first 4kcsq (87) when it was new there were fog
(driving ?) lights available from the dealer parts dept. (on sale cheap
too-shoulda woulda coulda...) that fit where these reflectors are located.
This was a kit complete with factory switch and wiring. Perhaps Linda could
shed some light (pun intended) on this? HTH...
Mike Veglia
4ksq
------------------------------
From: Dave Lawson <dlawson@digitalglobe.com>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 14:18:23 -0700
Subject: re: ice auto-x
>
The Continental Divide Region is happy to announce our 1997 Winter
schedule has been updated. This includes a rare "Night" ICE Autocross
in Steamboat Springs on Saturday Feb. 1st. Please stop by our Web page
and check out the updated schedule.
WEB Page "http://www.hp.net/~cdrscca/index.html"
>
This even just happens to fall on the weekend the quattro Club is at
the winter driving school in Steamboat. I didn't do it last year but it
looked like fun.
I also learned of another winter event. Check out
http://www.sni.net/~cnjohann/snowdrft.htm
A co worker has done one of these rallyes the past few
summers and says it is pretty fun. He drives his jeep as
these are sometimes over gravel/dirt farm roads, which really
aren't maintained. And you need to watch out for the roaming
livestock.
- -
Dave
------------------------------
From: "Meron" <phwomp@cosmoslink.net>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 13:22:10 -0800
Subject: Re: Oil Stuff
1) Does multi-vis therefore have NO advantages? Since I doubt this
is the case, what are the ones it does have?
The above question is rather complicated and I hesitate to come up with a
straight answer, let me just mention a few thoughts, even though nobody (on
a professional level) deny the fact that all oils lose the multi-vis
characteristics trait rather quickly, they (the oil companies) still claim
it!? and thechnically , they are making a false statement!
Now if you ask "should I switch to single grade oil?" my answer is NO, and
the explanation is that a lot of research is going toward the multi
viscosity oils and at present time they are the most advanced on the market
( excluding industrial oils, a different world all together).
I am apologizing for not being able to have a better definite answer.
>(My understanding is that
>synthetic is slower to lose volatile elements, and is more
>stable in terms of lasting before it breaks down in viscosity.)
Your understanding is correct to some degree but not in relation to
viscosity..
First no oil lose its viscosity (viscosity: the properity of resistance to
flow in a liquid) it just changes....
The whole issue (for syntethic oils) is that synthetic oils are (basically)
a single grade, the SAE test (I think it's SAE but it might be ASTM) is not
applicable to synthetic oils, synthetic oils maintain their viscosity a lot
better that std. oils so you DON'T need a synthetic that is multi
viscosity, in the early days of synthetic oils it was mostly sold as a
single grade BUT since consumers are so conditioned to multi-visc. The oil
companies felt they had to classify their oils as a multi-visc. in order to
penetrate the consumer market. Again "multi-visc." makes no difference (or
extremely little) in relation to synthetic oils. If you try to pour (which
is more or less the viscosity test) 10W oil in, say, -20F it will pour like
80W in +70F (examples are estimates only) but if you pour 40W synthetic in
- -20F it will pour like 50W in +70F, big difference!!!!
The above is information related to me by Mobil chemical engineering
personal and corroborated by many tests professional and personal.
I hope the above helps,
with great respect to all our esteem list members,
Avi Meron
86 5Kcstq
I am not always the devil advocate but never one to miss an
opportunity.....
------------------------------
From: Peter Henriksen <peterhe@microsoft.com>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 13:20:05 -0800
Subject: RE: Volvo AWD (Was: What are my choices?)
I didn't think the Volvo system was as advanced as quattro...
Maybe not as advanced, but just as useful? (Possibly Nomex On.)
- - peter
peterhe@microsoft.com - http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/1001
91 200qw
94 acura legend gs
issaquah, wa, usa
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Alexei M Voloshin [SMTP:Alexei.M.Voloshin-1@tc.umn.edu]
>Sent: Friday, January 24, 1997 12:29 PM
>To: Peter Henriksen
>Cc: 'smullen@philly.infi.net'; 'Duff, Ian'; 'quattro@coimbra.ans.net'
>Subject: Re: Volvo AWD (Was: What are my choices?)
>
>According to a Russian auto newspaper test - 850 AWD smoked the new A6 Q
>in adverse weather handling test. They got a great picture of an A6 Q
>taking a sharp turn and with both of its inside wheels in the air. The
>test was conducted in Switzerland and Spain.
>
>Hmmm... those guys are usually pretty good, but I wonder whether this
>time...
>
>Alex
>
>On Fri, 24 Jan 1997, Peter Henriksen wrote:
>
>> It'll be slush only in the 193hp and 220+hp versions :-( AWD or not,
>> they're only offering a manual transmission on the 168hp base models.
>>
>> I can't believe nobody has picked up on the demand for the 91 200qw and
>> 95 S6 wagons and started bringing in high performance wagons with stick
>> shifts. Volvo have the prefect opportunity now that Audi doesn't have
>> anything in that market and they have the models in Europe.
>>
>> Can't wait for the A4 1.8T Quattro Avant.
>> - peter
>> peterhe@microsoft.com - http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/1001
>> 91 200qw
>> 94 acura legend gs
>> issaquah, wa, usa
>>
>>
>> >-----Original Message-----
>> >From: Shaun Mullen [SMTP:smullen@philly.infi.net]
>> >Sent: Friday, January 24, 1997 8:09 AM
>> >To: Duff, Ian
>> >Cc: quattro@coimbra.ans.net
>> >Subject: Re: What are my choices?
>> >
>> >Duff, Ian wrote:
>> >> . . . Audi is our first choice, however, she is also considering
>> >> one of those Swedish Bricks. Not a *bad* car, mind you, just no quattro.
>> >
>> >At the risk of committing q-list hersesy, note that the AWD Volvo wagon
>> >is skedded for late March-early April delivery in the states. I have
>> >heard it will be offered in a five-speed. I also have heard that it
>> >will only be offered with a slushbox. The missus might check your local
>> >Volvo dealer to see what kind of tranny is being offered.
>>
------------------------------
From: Huw Powell <human@nh.ultranet.com>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 16:30:10 -0500
Subject: Re: Corroded Words??
- -- [ From: Huw Powell * EMC.Ver #3.1a ] --
> I've got an old ****-box at home
any chance of editing out the profanity before sending? My mother still
reads my mail :-)
Huw Powell
HUMAN Speakers
and your memory's like a train...
you can see it getting smaller as it pulls away
Tom Waits
http://www.thebook.com/human-speakers
------------------------------
From: Huw Powell <human@nh.ultranet.com>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 16:30:47 -0500
Subject: Re: Dead Horses (shoot 'em again)
- -- [ From: Huw Powell * EMC.Ver #3.1a ] --
> However, my background includes statistical analysis and 21 years with dad
, Yale Professor (the late John W., ex dean of Engineering: Yale and UofF)
who really taught me to question everything "experts" stated, it was his way
------------------------------
From: sincatx@airmail.net
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 15:25:44 -0600 (CST)
Subject: F/S S6 Parts list
All For Sale make realistic offer.
All from 1995 S6 with 20k miles on it.
steering wheel w/o air bag(blew)
instrument cluster
2 frt. Alxes assm. comp. with CVs
both frt fenders need alittel work
sunroof assm with frame track and motor
Dr. side rear door complete
Dr. side frt door window assm with reg.
Air box not bag
rear diff.
duel exhuast system with twin cats
rear hud spindel assm.
frt. subframe complete with a/r bar and control arms
rad. fan cluch
intercooler
steering colum
steering rack
fuel sender
bose stereo system with all speakers & wiring
interor blower
interior flap control box
heater core assm.
ABS brake system hyd. & ecu
brake master cyl.
Let me know what you want and how much you will give??
Thanks Rick
------------------------------
From: sincatx@airmail.net
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 15:26:05 -0600 (CST)
Subject: F/S Parts QTC&5KT
I am cleaning out the garage before my new progect need to
make room.So must sell parts for space.
All parts used but in great shape less than 50K miles on them.
guarenteed working
83 QTC: Frt. Brake Cals./Hydro Boost/Accum. Regulater/master cyl.
rear brake pro. valve/rear disc Turned/intercooler/
steering wheel/solid lifter cam./eng.ECU computer (needs press switch)
air reg. valve.
85 5KT: intake man./throttle bodie/waste gate(dual Diag.)/intercooler
fuel ing. lines set/intercooler end caps/eng.ECUs mac 07 & mac 07A
make offers Rick 972 641-4778 after 7:30 central
------------------------------
From: sincatx@airmail.net
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 15:26:00 -0600 (CST)
Subject: NEED S6 WHEELS
Any body out their know where I can find S6 wheels used
I need 2 of them.These are 6 spoke 16 X 7.5 37mm offset.
Please let me know. Thanks Rick sincatx@airmail.net
------------------------------
From: gds@aluxs.micro.lucent.com (Glenn Strouse [5285])
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 97 16:33:52 EST
Subject: '89 80 Quattro Purchase
Fellow VW/Audi people. I am looking for info for a purchase that I am about to
make. I have found a 1989 80 Quattro. It seems to be in good condition, 5sp, pwr
everything, ABS and (gulp) 125K miles on it. Because of the miles I can get it for, what
I think is a very good price, $4500.00 .
I would like to know any and all information you might be able to supply me with about
this car and or any 80/90 information.
Also, things that I should look for, quattro concerns, and "the good, the bad and the ugly"
about this model, and year.
I am located in the Allentown, PA area, if this makes a difference.
Thanks in advance. I know I will get much usesfull information from this group.
Glenn Strouse
------------------------------
From: Linus Toy <linust@mindspring.com>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 13:33:45 -0800
Subject: Re: Steering Wheel Squeak
At 05:54 PM 1/22/97 -0700, KLeeds wrote:
>My steering wheel/steering column in my 91 200tq is emitting an
>annoying squeak when I turn the wheel. Anybody know if I can just
>spray something in there? Or am I faced with a horrifying disassembly
>project? I hate those mieces to pieces!
out of curiosity, is the story something like this: only does it during the
winter,
only when really cold & dry, only when turning the wheel (left or right)
from one spot.
mine's been doing it for years, goes away each spring.
- --linus
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
* linus toy email: linust@mindspring.com *
* mercer island, wa *
* *
* The obscure we eventually see, *
* the completely obvious, it seems, takes longer. *
* - Edward R. Murrow *
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------
------------------------------
From: "Sheffield Corey" <SHEF@omdc.gso.uri.edu>
Date: 24 Jan 97 17:49:00 EST
Subject: Re: Garage/Mechanic recommendation
>Dan,
> With this service testimonial from Peter below, in addition to the parts and
>service myself, Mike D., Shef C., Glen P. and others have received with great
>satifaction - perhaps we should add Autobahn Motors of NH to the vendors list,
>and Chris/Autobahn to the mechanics list...
>
>Just my tired brain thinking...
>
>-Stott Hare (YES, STOTT!)
Hi Dan,
I second Stott's motion to add Autobahn and Bro' Chris to their
respective lists:-) A fine group to do business with...and have some fun at the
same time.
Happy motoring,
Shef
5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO
0 5
0 Shef Corey 0
0 Ocean Mapping Development Center 0
C Graduate School of Oceanography 0
S University of Rhode Island C
Q Tele.: 401-874-6879 S
U E-mail: shef@omdc.gso.uri.edu Q
A QCUSA: #1857 U
T A
T QUATTRO: the way to GO when the road says NO!! T
O T
5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO
------------------------------
From: "Sheffield Corey" <SHEF@omdc.gso.uri.edu>
Date: 24 Jan 97 17:56:00 EST
Subject: Re: Light Research
>It is the alternator that is producing the electric power when the
>engine is running. That's why you want to run the lights off the
>alternator - to get the highest voltage possible. The battery only
>delivers current during starting; the rest of the time it is being
>recharged. As far as the lights are concerned, it is a giant capacitor.
>
>Luis Marques
I'm no electrical engineer, but doesn't routing via the battery
"filter" out any AC ripple that may be coming from the alternator and
shortening bulb life? Just a question...and a thought.
Happy motoring,
Shef
5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO
0 5
0 Shef Corey 0
0 Ocean Mapping Development Center 0
C Graduate School of Oceanography 0
S University of Rhode Island C
Q Tele.: 401-874-6879 S
U E-mail: shef@omdc.gso.uri.edu Q
A QCUSA: #1857 U
T A
T QUATTRO: the way to GO when the road says NO!! T
O T
5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO5000CSQUATTRO
------------------------------
From: "Byron West" <bwest@hsdcf.uvic.ca>
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 14:28:01 PST
Subject: lets all talk audi
Hi there all you audi fans, how are ya? Im chasing down information
on the Audi company. Went to the German and US web pages but they
dont really help. Specifically their approaches to marketing the
sports cars (quattro) or any car marketing information would be
WUNDERBAR!. Oh yeah, I drove the new A8 the other day - what a
machine! It was the one with the all steel winter tires n stuff.
Byron West
Audi AG - Motorsportvermarktung
Vorsprung Durch Technik
------------------------------
From: quk@sievers.com (Phil Payne)
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 22:22:51 GMT
Subject: Volvo AWD (Was: What are my choices?)
In message <c=US%a=_%p=msft%l=RED-84-MSG-970124212005Z-58356@INET-04-IMC.microsoft.com> Peter Henriksen writes:
> I didn't think the Volvo system was as advanced as quattro...
>
> Maybe not as advanced, but just as useful? (Possibly Nomex On.)
I had the "drive from hell" today in the ur-quattro.
I met three polite and considerate ovloV drivers who used their mirrors.
I met two polite and pleasant Saab 9000 drivers and we snaked through a few
trucks together.
I met one polite and pleasant 911 Targa driver.
And three absolute ******** in Saab 900 turbos. Worse than _anything_ ovloV
used to produce.
A (non-Audi) question - chasing the Porsche I noticed his rear grill would
swing up and down - sometimes at picnic table level, sometimes flush with the
body and never stationary in between. What is this - is it a feature?
- --
Phil Payne
phil@sievers.com
Committee Member, UK Audi [ur-]quattro Owners Club
------------------------------
From: QSHIPQ@aol.com
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 17:35:34 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Thermostat Information
In a message dated 97-01-24 13:48:03 EST, you write:
<< Ho hum. Is the "thermostat" issue also dead? I'm still waiting for 100c
water
temperature part numbers for any engine, and oil thermostat part numbers for
the WR, GV, WX, MB, RR and KW engines?
>>
Hardly Phil, hope this helps you some. Thanks for the reminder. Audi lists
the following part #'s for your information, 2 wire interchangeable to 2
wire, 3 to 3. Here you go:
035-121-113 80C thermostat
035-121-113B 87C thermostat - MC
The Fan switch choices are as follows:
AUDI PN APP
321-959-481E 2-pin 95-84C
823-959-481D 2-pin 82-77C
823-959-481E 2 pin 70-75C
823-959-481F 2-pin 92-87C
811-959-481 2-pin 95-90C (86-87 coupe)
321-959-481 3-pin 93-88C/85-80C
321-959-481D 3-pin 102-91C/95-84C
ALL oil cooled audi applications list 100c as the only oil thermo
application. For Phil's peace of mind let me write this, THERE IS NO 100c
THERMOSTAT. My post is in reference to the optimal operating temperature for
the audis being 100c. Phil interpreted this to mean there is a 100c
thermostat, there is not, apologies to anyone that got that impression. My
advisory is that you be careful running a cooler thermostat, all the above
are listed as specific car applications. You can see that if you put the 80c
water thermo in a car with a 959 481 3 pin switch, you could have the fan
operating before the thermostat is open, not good.
If you mess with these, understand: 1) you may not pass emissions, 2) you may
not increase the perfomance of the car, 3) your gas mileage can go down, 4)
you can get oil blow by on an MC motor rings in the winter. My suggestion as
posted, would be to leave all the thermostats as stock, increasing the size
of the radiator or the oil cooler as the way to address heat issues. If I
need to be more clear in the above, please do post.
As for reference to 100c.... There are currently 2 schools of thought
regarding engine operating temperatures, 1 favors the 75C approach to oil,
since that is where the Viscocity index is usually referenced, and the 2nd
references the 100c approach, 75 is not enough to release the moisture
(water) that collects in the oil from heat cycles. Audi designs it's motors
with the second approach in mind.
Any corrections or additions gladly accepted.
HTH
Scott
------------------------------
From: JOSEV@samson-transport.com (Jose Vicente)
Date: Fri, 24 Jan 1997 16:35:02 +0000
Subject: (Fwd) APPLE HILL, a success
- ------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
From: Self <EWR/JOSEV>
To: Daniel Hussey <GY3WSX@VM.SC.EDU>,quattro@coimbra.ans.net
Organization: Samson Transport (USA) Inc.
Subject: APPLE HILL, a success
Date: Thu, 23 Jan 1997 13:29:33
Hi Dan,
Apple hill was a great success, lots of people showed up to spectate
and some of the drivers really put on a big show. The star of the
rally had to be Constantine, I have been a personal friend of his for
a few years and I've seen him race plenty of times but never like he
did on sunday. The whole thing started when Ivan Orisek showed up
with his 340 hp 4000 quattro. It was the first rally for the SCCA NED
divisional championship (aside from Maine in wich they both DNF'd)
and they both wanted the win real bad. Both Ivan and Constantine were
pushing right on the limit, with Constantine winning by a small
margin. after the service Ivan broke a front axle and was left with a
340hp REAR WHEEL drive Audi 4000, Constantine lost it on a hair
pin and spun it around a couple of times, then when off again and
lost about 30 seconds. Now Jacek is in 1st place with his Eagle Talon
and he was running very smart, fast and consistently. Constantine got
back on track and really put out some spectacular driving but above
all even more spectacular stage times. Going in to the last stage he
was back on the lead by more than 30 secons over Jacek. Ivan was left
back to 3rd place and Carlos Fillipe with his group A GTI 4th.
Then it happened, the highlite of the day. Constantine is coming down
the rear straight like a mad man out of hell, and before the last
turn before the finish line, he rolled over in to a six foot drop,
landed on the roof and kept rolling till the car eventually stopped
on it's wheels. no one was hurt but it costed him the race.
The car is pretty much wrecked, and he will be building a new car
soon, I cant tell you what it is yet but it has a 20 VALVE TURBO, and
we all know Constantine loves BIG AUDIs, see the connection?.
The rest of the cars finished one position above the mentioned,
Jacek was first, Ivan was second and Carlos was third.
Anyway Apple hill was great fun and a real success. I'm really
looking forward to the summer event there (hopefully I'll be racing).
RALLY ON
Jose Vicente
the results I mention are not yet official
*** Visit us on the web at http://www.intac.com/~samson
------------------------------
End of quattro-digest V4 #157
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