RE: auto up/down power windows

["Buchholz, Steven" <Steven.Buchholz@kla-tencor.com>]

> > IME the way the auto down works is that it will attempt to open the
> window
> > fully whether the switch is switched momentarily or held down.  To get
> the
> > motor to stop you can press the up switch.
> 
> problem here is if you daisy chain two units, when you tap "up" to stop
> the down motion, it will go all the way back up!  No, the proper way for
> these to work (IMHO) is a tap gets you full open or shut, a steady
> application gets you just as much as you want.  Oh well. 
> 
Given that the auto-down unit is designed with the expectation that it is
sensing the voltage at the motor, the daisy-chain idea may have other
problems in any case.  Since the auto-down controller has individual pins to
go to the switch and the motor it should be easily possible to detect that
the switch has been depressed while an automatic operation is in process and
use that information to stop the motor.  

You seem to like the function where if you quickly snap the switch to
activate the auto-down function, while holding the switch down causes the
control to work as it would on a window without the auto-down functionality.
That sort of thing might be a bit difficult to implement without major
changes ... perhaps the addition of a small microcontroller like a PIC would
be simpler than trying to figure out the logic changes and work it into the
existing circuitry.  I guess another option would be to see if there were
any other marques that had controllers that exhibited the behavior you are
looking for and then retrofit a controller from one of these cars into yours
...

> (I have the V8 info, thanks)
> 
>From the info that I have the function I described where you can close the
windows & sunroof with the door lock is called a "comfort feature" and seems
to be new with the '91 model ... at least I don't see any sign of it on the
wiring diagram I have.  
> > 
> > ... here are my thoughts on the auto up/down conversion ...
> > 
> > If you want to convert a window to auto up/down you are going to have to
> add
> > some extra wires from the control relay to the motor itself.  For this
> > reason it may be best to actually mount the relay in the door.  I think
> that
> > doing so will allow the auto down(/up) to operate from both the switch
> on
> > the driver's door and the door in question.
> 
> Coupe, 2 windows, switches in center.  one for each window.  makes it a
> lot simpler.
> 
Very true ... I'm always finding myself reaching for the window switch in
the wrong place ... the 4kSQ and QTC have the switches on the console, while
the 5kCSQ and V8q have them on the driver's door ... you don't have the
problem of trying to figure out which switch is for the front and which is
for the back (as I do especially with the 4k) either ... :)

> > 
> > I too have collected a few of the modules (did you know that the older
> 5kCS
> > (=> '86) has a controller that is a single-width unit?  These might be
> the
> > better choice for in the door mounting ...
> 
> Is it up and down?  P/N?  Please.  And to think I had one here - maybe I
> still have the relay, I'm sure I didn;t send it away with any installed
> in it!
> 
It is only an auto-down relay.  I believe that it also controls the function
that allows the windows to work after power is turned off.  I actually have
one of these, but I never opened it up to see if it has the requisite 3
relays.  
> > 
> > Keep up the effort Huw ... this is something I've wanted to do myself
> ...
> > I've just never had the discretionary time to push it through ...
> 
> $ gets to be an issue too... that's why I would love to know of a relay
> that will do what I want for certain and then chase down wrecks to get a
> couple!
> 
... what I am hoping to find is that the auto up/down relay is based on the
same relay that handles auto down only.   I see signs on the dual-width
module that this is in fact the case ... there appear to be places on the
boards where components have not been installed.  If it is possible to
figure out what parts need to be added it should be a fairly easy thing to
take any dual-width module and make it work both up & down.  That silly
module has two circuit boards inside and will take a bit of doing to
complete the reverse engineering process ...

Steve Buchholz
San Jose, CA (USA)